Template talk:Albanians

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Kosovo

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Ethnic groups

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Kosovo War[edit]

It's ridiculous not to include the Kosovo War as an incident involving persecution of Albanians. Also, regarding the old "is Kosovo part of Serbia question", yes it is, Noah, get used to it; this has been debated again and again; you cannot present a province of Serbia as a separate entity from Serbia (see Talk:Albanians). WP:NPOV#Undue weight - any Atlas will tell you that Kosovo is a province of Serbia. //Dirak 22:49, 27 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

see template:Serbs. They use Kosovo since the headline points that the list includes both regions and countries.

Haha, I created Template:Serbs. The only reason I did that is because there is no article about Serbs in Serbia. Kosovo is an internationally recognised part of Serbia, and you haven't opposed the other edits, so back it goes until you have something of substance to say. And sign your posts please. --Еstavisti 01:03, 28 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Dirak, even if we accept that Albanians were persecuted in the Kosovo War, we still shouldn't link to it in that rubric. Let me put it like this - is the Holocaust the same as WW2? If it is insisted upon, the best place for it is the history rubric. --Еstavisti 01:08, 28 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Illyrians[edit]

http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-42640/Albania

The origins of the Albanian people are not definitely known, but data drawn from history and from linguistic, archaeological, and anthropological studies have led to the conclusion that Albanians are the direct descendants of the ancient Illyrians and that the latter were natives of the lands they inhabited. Similarly, the Albanian language derives from the language of the Illyrians, the transition from Illyrian to Albanian apparently occurring between the 4th and 6th centuries AD.

http://www.ce-review.org/99/18/vaknin18.html

There is very little dispute among serious (that is, non-Greek, non-Macedonian and non-Serb) scholars that the Albanians are an ancient people, the descendants of the Illyrians or, as a small minority insists, of the Thracians. The Albanian language is a rather newer development (less than 1500 years old) - but it can also be traced back either to Thracian or to Illyrian. In a region obsessed with history, real and (especially) invented, these 4000-year-old facts are of enormous and practical import. --Noah30 22:02, 15 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The CE-review source by Sam Vanik is not a reliable source to ascertain the origin of the Albanians, check his credentials [1]; he's no historian or expert in the field. Britannica is another matter, so I won't be deleting the Illyrians, however, don't forget that it still says "[t]he origins of the Albanian people are not definitely known".--Domitius 22:08, 15 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Image[edit]

@Vif12vf Can you please stop edit warring/ deleting my constructive contributions? The symbol I am adding is still in use, and is more inclusive of Albanians of Kosovo, Greece, Italy, Croatia, Arbereshe, and Arvanite, plus the diaspora community not just the citizens of the moden Republic of Albania (most albanians have never lived in the republic of albania and are not from there). that symbol is non inclusive and is actually inaccurate considering this is a template for the ethnicity, not the country. There is a separate template for the republic of albania where the coat of arms is included. Brikcity (talk) 06:08, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think the question here essentially is - is there any evidence of that flag being widely used by Albanian diaspora and communities in countries bordering Albania? If so, ok. If not, better stick with the current one. --Soman (talk) 11:55, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

yep, I believe it has more precedent to be used as its the flag most common among all the different albanians, most notably the arvanite, and arbereshe, who are not part of the diaspora from the modern republic of albania, but are native to greece and italy, respectively (this is also reflected in the template itself). the coat of arms of modern albania isn't really representative of anyone outside of that state. I think i'll go back to using this flag for the sake of inclusion, but I'm happy to continue this conversation, especially with any Albanians who feel otherwise Brikcity (talk) 00:49, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with @Brikcity: the current image is the best representative one. – Βατο (talk) 08:56, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It doesn't matter what editors personally think or prefer; are there any reliable sources that indicate that this flag is widely used by Albanians around the world? The file description of File:Albania Flag.png calls it "the flag Skanderbeg rose" and provides primary sources depicting the family crest design in the flag, but not the actual flag itself. It seems to me that this file was a modern recreation of a 15th-century flag as described in written sources. Neither the file description nor the comments in this discussion have indicated that the flag is widely used by Albanians beyond "just trust me". Yue🌙 02:25, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The symbol of ethnic Albanians is the symbol of their national hero, Skanderbeg, and this is his flag, which has been historically reproduced by all Albanian flags in Albania, Kosovo, Italy, etc. If an image is to be added to this template, this flag is the most representative one. – Βατο (talk) 07:07, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]