Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Fleece jacket

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. (non-admin closure) Rcsprinter₁₂₃ (drone) @ 21:36, 22 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Fleece jacket

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There's no reason to have a stub for every combination of garment and material. Fails WP:GNG and there's no content worth merging elsewhere. Tchaliburton (talk) 05:25, 14 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Not seeing any reason to discriminate this popular type of garment. Andrew D. (talk) 00:07, 15 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not seeing any indication of notability. Tchaliburton (talk) 00:14, 15 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Fashion-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 22:47, 15 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

There seems to be plenty of coverage visible in the search links above - typically in periodicals about backpacking and other outdoor pursuits. Andrew D. (talk) 10:21, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - I'm seeing independent sources discussing the fleece jacket and what is expected of it. For example, [1] which, although a review of fleeces, IS in a reliable source national newspaper, and describes what is expected of them, and the specific purposes they fulfil. I also found [2] which starts out by describing how fleece jackets have been an important part of outdoor clothing for 30 years, and gives details on what is usually expected of fleece jackets. A good description in GQ Magazine here describing how such jackets were worn and their associations. Although I think the Huffington Post is not always considered a reliable source, it is another source that specifically discusses and considers fleece jackets. And here's a critical article on these garments - so it's not all promotional. Another critical piece here about how fleeces, by shedding fibres, are not considered appropriate in many surgical environments (and another source here to back up. There's clear coverage specifically discussing fleece jackets in this book, explaining how these jackets compare to other alternatives. In fact, a political journalist has even written a whole book about a fleece jacket, describing its entire manufacturing process, where it was made, all the processes in its design and production, and its eventual end in landfill once its useful life has ended. And this is what I found after only 15 minutes Googling and searching. Mabalu (talk) 01:46, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

These seem to be product reviews and passing mentions. Made on Earth is the only piece with significant depth and it's about globalization, using a fleece jacket to illustrate the point. You could find similar coverage for wool socks, cotton underwear or silk blouses. T.C.Haliburton^{talk nerdy to me} 01:58, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I think you're missing the point. A fleece is an individual garment in its own right. Clearly it's being called a jacket here as a disambiguator in order to distinguish it from the skin or the fabric. It's not like silk blouses or wool socks. A fleece does not particularly resemble any other jacket and there is more than sufficient coverage clarifying what makes it distinct, the purposes it's expected to have, and notes on the messages and impressions it gives when worn. Mabalu (talk) 09:39, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Is there anything here that can't be included at polar fleece? T.C.Haliburton^{talk nerdy to me} 15:42, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Polar fleece is about the fabric, not the jacket. The fleece (the garment) is identified by its fabric, just like jeans are identified by their fabric, but just as not all jeans are made of jean, fleeces are not necessarily made from the one fabric called polar fleece. There are references to cotton fleeces and fleeces made using other fibres. So yes, I'd say there is a lot here that couldn't be included at polar fleece without throwing the focus of that article off by having a huge section that isn't 100% relevant. Mabalu (talk) 16:15, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Do we separate articles for fleece vest and fleece pants then? T.C.Haliburton^{talk nerdy to me} 16:29, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

While sleeveless jackets made of fleece could legitimately be called fleece vests, and trousers could be made of fleece, the former is essentially the same thing as a fleece, whether sleeved or not. Sleeved status doesn't matter. There's no such thing as "fleece pants" as a concept in itself - probably tracksuit bottoms or "joggers" would be closest thing to that. At the end of the day, I would suggest that this article be renamed Fleece (jacket) or Fleece (clothing) which would cover both sleeved and unsleeved versions of the fleece. Mabalu (talk) 17:11, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

There are fleece pants. Also fleece socks, even fleece underwear. T.C.Haliburton^{talk nerdy to me} 17:21, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I really don't see what your point is any more - it seems to have degenerated into pointing that other crap made of fleece exists and asking why they don't have articles, and quite frankly that's irrelevant to the question about fleece jackets. A fleece is equivalent to a leather jacket in that it is a garment in its own right with cultural presence and wearer significance. It has been worn almost non-stop over a period of 30 years and counting, is a staple of modern school and work uniforms, is a standard merchandise staple for custom printing companies, and is an essential part of the wardrobe for a not insignificant percentage of the community. When you say "fleece jacket", people know exactly what you mean, and if they don't, I'm not responsible for their sartorial illiteracy. They will come to Wikipedia looking for further information on it - what it signifies - when it was first made - why it is called a fleece. That makes it an encyclopaedic subject. And on that note - I'm done, I see no point in arguing any more as I feel I've made my case. Mabalu (talk) 17:40, 18 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

My point is that there's nothing special about this piece of clothing. It does not meet WP:GNG. Simply existing doesn't make something encyclopedic. T.C.Haliburton^{talk nerdy to me} 21:30, 18 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Keep It is a major distinctive product, and there are sufficient references. Most other garments or other objects made of this material won't be notable, but some might--I think we could conceivably have an article on "fleece blanket". DGG ( talk ) 20:02, 20 December 2014 (UTC);[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.