User talk:Joel Bradshaw

Hello Joel Bradshaw! Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. If you decide that you need help, check out Wikipedia:Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. Finally, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field. Below are some recommended guidelines to facilitate your involvement. Happy Editing! Cheers, :) Dlohcierekim 16:18, 4 October 2006 (UTC) Getting Started Wikipedia Tutorial How to edit a page The five pillars of Wikipedia Manual of Style Be bold in editing How to write a great article WikiProjects Getting your info out there Cite your sources Neutral Point of View Point of View Verifiability Uploading images Image use policy Getting more Wikipedia rules Policy Library Getting Help New contributors' help page Where to ask a question Help Desk Frequently Asked Questions Getting along Wikiquette Civility Sign your posts Wikipedians Conflict resolution Getting technical Cleaning up vandalism Pages needing attention Peer review Utilities Village pump

Possibly unfree Image:Manoajournalcover.jpg

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The Contemporary Pacific

Hi. I just wanted, first of all, to thank you for creating the article on The Contemporary Pacific. Good work. I found it by chance after creating the article on Vilsoni Hereniko, and noticing that yours linked to mine. It inspired me to create the articles on John Pule, Ake Lianga and Larry Santana. Second, I wanted to let you know that the article on Ake Lianga has been nominated for deletion by a user who feels that Lianga is "not notable" and not worthy of having an article about him in Wikipedia. If you'd like to comment, the discussion is here. Thanks. Aridd (talk) 17:02, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

Invite

Aloha! You look like someone who might be interested in joining the Hawaii WikiProject and so I thought I'd drop you a line and invite you! We'd love to have you help us :-) Viriditas (talk) 09:59, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

I'd be happy to join. Joel (talk) 18:00, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Glad to have you. I apologize, but there's a lot of work to do! :) Viriditas (talk) 22:02, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Hawaiʻi WikiProject Newsletter - Issue III - June 2008

Aloha. The June 2008 issue of the Hawaiʻi WikiProject newsletter has been published. To change your delivery options or unsubscribe, visit this link. Mahalo nui loa. WikiProject Hawaiʻi 22:02, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Hawaiʻi WikiProject Newsletter - Issue IV - July 2008

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Hawaiʻi WikiProject Newsletter - Issue V - August 2008

Aloha. The August 2008 issue of the Hawaiʻi WikiProject newsletter has been published. To change your delivery options or unsubscribe, visit this link. Mahalo nui loa. WikiProject Hawaiʻi 13:27, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Hawaiʻi WikiProject Newsletter - Issue VI - September 2008

Aloha. The September 2008 issue of the Hawaiʻi WikiProject newsletter has been published. To change your delivery options or unsubscribe, visit this link. Mahalo nui loa. WikiProject Hawaiʻi 14:32, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

Hawaiʻi WikiProject Newsletter - Issue VII - October 2008

Aloha. The October 2008 issue of the Hawaiʻi WikiProject newsletter has been published. To change your delivery options or unsubscribe, visit this link. Mahalo nui loa. WikiProject Hawaiʻi 17:24, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Papuan vs. Austronesian languages

Please consult the Wikipedia entries on Papuan languages and Austronesian languages. Just because a language is spoken in Papua New Guinea does not mean it is a "Papuan" language. (In any case, Mangga is spoken on the New Guinea side, not the Papuan side of the country.) The Buang languages, including Mangga, are Austronesian, which in the PNG linguistic context means they are not Papuan, since Papuan is a catchall label for all the indigenous languages that are not Austronesian. I did my dissertation in linguistics on the languages of that area. Joel (talk) 18:02, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

If you had bothered to read my edit[1] you would have noticed that I am aware of what you say above and that the article now reflects that. The problem with your edit was that you removed Mangga Buang, not just as an example of a Papuan langauge but, as an example of a language that combines alienable/inalienable and inherent/non-inherent possession marking. Since no other languages of Papua NG are given as an example the phrase without the example was non-informative - you should have just changed the incorrect classification "papuan" to "austronesian" and kept the example. Thats what I did.·Maunus·ƛ· 05:45, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

I reacted to your comment that you reverted my edit, and on frivolous grounds without citing any documentation. Your reworking solves the first problem, but not the second.

Its not a reworking I have only made one edit to that article you just read only the edit summary without looking at the edit. I admit it was mistake to let the edit summary say "undid" when in fact it wasn't a reversion but a change. What was the second problem?·Maunus·ƛ· 11:33, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

Where did you encounter your documentation for Mangga Buang? I don't see a footnote (or an author:date citation, which I'm more used to). I've been trying to add entries for a lot of obscure PNG languages for which I've collected some pretty old print sources. I have a little material on Buang, but nothing on Mangga (except I know that the sociolinguist Gillian Sankoff did her Ph.D. research in an area that spoke Mangga). Joel (talk) 01:24, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

I am not the one who added the phrase in the first place - so I don't knwo whether Mangga is in fact a good example of a language with this kind of possession. The only documentation I have consulted is the ethnologue - which was enough to assert that it is an Austronesian language spoken in the mumeng district of Papua New Guinea. It however a problem that there is no documentation for the original claim - but then again the entire article is weakly referenced. We could of course remove the entire phrase as unsourced - but do you think there is a reason to not believe the claim about the grammar of possession in mangga buang?·Maunus·ƛ· 07:55, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

I don't really see much point in citing an undocumented language as an example of something, without citing either any actual forms or any place to find such forms. But I think I have found good examples in the Austronesian Yabem language, another of the Huon Gulf languages. I'll add a section on inalienable vs. inherent possession under Yabem, then summarize and link to it from the possession entry when I next get a chance.Joel (talk) 23:50, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

What you're doing at the article seems very reasonable.·Maunus·ƛ· 09:52, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Hawaiʻi WikiProject Newsletter - Issue VIII - November 2008

Aloha. The November 2008 issue of the Hawaiʻi WikiProject newsletter has been published. To change your delivery options or unsubscribe, visit this link. Mahalo nui loa. WikiProject Hawaiʻi 06:58, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

Charles Montague Cooke, Jr.

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Pictures

At the rate you're going, we're soon going to have the entire Oahu NRHP list illustrated. Keep it up :-) Nyttend (talk) 02:10, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, but some of the buildings are no longer there, and some of the places are off-limits. I went searching for the Lishman building in Makiki Park yesterday and, after further research, found it had been replaced by a swimming pool. Anyway, the project provides a good excuse to take walks in interesting old neighborhoods. Joel (talk) 02:21, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Can you prove that it's no longer there, either (1) by finding documentation, or (2) getting a picture of the site in verifiable surroundings? If so, you could post such a picture on the list: look what I did for the Homer Laughlin House at the Columbiana County, Ohio list. Meanwhile, regardless of whether you can get a picture, if you can prove it please leave a notice at WP:NRIS issues. This page details a wide range of problems that have been discovered in the Register database, ranging from spelling mistakes to destroyed buildings that are still officially listed. Thanks! Nyttend (talk) 12:15, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

By the way, is the thing located at 21°18′11.052″N 157°50′12.624″W the pool that you mean? Nyttend (talk) 12:28, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

Yes, it took me a long time to track down an online report with photo by a Lishman house preservation society or some such, who fought the plan to turn it in a pool for some years before losing. We used to live near Makiki Park at the time. I'll try to track it down again and leave references at WP:NRIS. Another big issue with the Register is lack of clarity about exactly which buildings are included or not in Historic District listings, the Capitol District being the biggest such problem that I've encountered. Joel (talk) 18:44, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

For the Capital District, go to this page. The NRHP's NPS Focus page provides links to the original nomination forms for many properties and districts nationwide, including some Hawaii ones, and if you look at a nomination form, you'll see that they always include maps with the location of the property or highlighted areas for the buildings in a district. Nyttend (talk) 01:01, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Nuts. Now I've done one smaller historic district and you've provided the links to enable me to take on the largest historic district in the state. I'll probably get around to it eventually. Many of buildings have their own separate entries, but I'd like to add a few that don't yet.

NRHP in Hawaii length

W Nowicki yesterday noted that the Hawaii list was getting too long; would you like to help split into separate island lists? It's standard practice to break up a too-long list page like this into smaller articles. In other states the lists are split by counties, but there it's also listed by counties, while at the Hawaii list we go by islands, so if we split it we should split it by islands. Nyttend (talk) 12:22, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

So the new headings would be "National Register of Historic Places on Oahu"/"... on Maui"/etc. (rather than in Maui/etc.)? Yes, I'd be happy to create such a page first for Oahu (the main culprit) and copy everything over (and excite the copyright violation robot as I did the last time I moved content from one entry to another leaving it undeleted as backup), then simplify the Oahu section of the NRHP in Hawaii by just linking to the main entry. If there is something else involved, please warn me. Joel (talk) 18:34, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

Well, the in/on issue is under discussion. Oahu and Hawaii have been split out to separate articles, but with different titles: it's "in Oahu" but "on the island of Hawaii". I prefer "on", and so does W Nowicki, but Doncram (who has long been a leader in the overall NRHP project, so deserves to be listened to) has at least a weak preference for "in". However, to none of us is it a big issue, so I'll welcome your opinion on the question and I'm sure that everyone else will likewise appreciate it. Nyttend (talk) 04:16, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Well, I feel just as weakly about it as the rest of you do. I would prefer "on" if we're talking about an island, rather than a county, but if "in" makes the coding to collate similar listings more straightforward, that's fine. And I can well understand the need to replace local use of "the Big Island" with "the island of Hawaii." Anyway, that's my Macadamia-nut waffle. You'd never know I once copyedited for a living! Joel (talk) 05:20, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

I've given advice in response to your questions about group and district articles. If you want more opinions from me, just tell me. Nyttend (talk) 00:55, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. I had a long conversation with Doncram about how to deal with compound NRHPs and I'm still following up on that one (Kawaiahao Church and Mission Houses). Every little project seems to snowball. Joel (talk) 01:38, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Chinatown HD

Just wanted to let you know —— I've undone your change to the boundaries given at the Oahu list for the Chinatown Historic District: the boundaries given for NRHP districts are sometimes rather vague and imprecise, but for that reason I believe it's best to give what the NRIS lists as the boundaries, lest we misunderstand them and give boundaries that include properties not included in the actual district. Make sense, or am I missing something? Nyttend (talk) 22:50, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I think you are missing something and just reacted to my "edit boundaries" note without comparing the wording. I kept exactly the same ("rough") boundaries, but clarified what was opposite what and just eliminated the misleading cardinal directions attributes (which suggest that Nuuanu Ave. and Nuuanu Stream are not parallel) and don't make much sense in the Hawaii context, where Nuuanu Ave. (SW to NE) divides N. Beretania from S. Beretania (NW to SE). Joel (talk) 07:14, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

Merchant Street Historic District

Hi, good work with Merchant Street Historic District. It's ready for a WP:DYK. If you don't have time, I can help you submit it. Is there a particular factoid (hook) you would like to see on the main page? Viriditas (talk) 11:59, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks a lot. I spent most of the weekend on it, after a gestation period that began during an April 2007 Architectural Walking Tour! It kept snowballing. I would appreciate your help submitting it to WP:DYK. I suppose the two most interesting factoids I turned up were things I found via other Wikipedia entries: (1) the connection of the T.R. Foster Building to Foster Botanical Garden and Inter-Island Steam Navigation Company, which explains why the 1891 Foster Building (O'Toole's), but not the better-known, corner-entrance 1890 Royal Saloon Building (Murphy's), was mentioned on the NRHP nomination form; and (2) the unexpected explanation for the alternate name of the old Honolulu Police Station, the Walter Murray Gibson Building. One connection I failed to find in Wikipedia (or elsewhere yet) was that between Matson Navigation Company and Inter-Island Steam Navigation Company, both founded in 1882. Joel (talk) 15:45, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

I just discovered and added another little factoid. Louis Davis, the architect of the 1931 Spanish Mission Revival police station, had earlier designed the ornately Chinese Zamboanga Theatre, which opened as the New Palama in 1930. He also designed the Princess and the Cinerama! I'll create a stub entry for Louis Davis (U.S. architect), citing the Cinema Treasures website, then add my own photos of the theatres to Wikimedia Commons, then add a little gallery! Joel (talk) 16:39, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Ok, give me some time to try to put something together. One requirement is that the sources have to be explicit. In other words, when a DYK reviewer looks at the source, it has to support the hook. Viriditas (talk) 22:55, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Question: Is the Sandler et al. source in the references section actually used in the article? If not, I'll move it to further reading. Viriditas (talk) 23:02, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Note: If you expand Louis Davis past 1,500 characters, and link to it in the hook, you will get credit for two DYK's. Viriditas (talk) 23:09, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

If you expand the Louis Davis article by just one more paragraph, add section headings, and remove the stub tag, we should be good to go. I might be able to help. Viriditas (talk) 23:26, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

I haven't been able to dig up much new on Louis Davis, although I can add Cinerama & Zamboanga photos after I get home. (There's a more recently deceased Louis E. Davis, professor of workplace engineering or some such in California.) I've mined everything I could get from the Googlebooks version of Sakamoto et al. (2008) Hawaiian Modern, as well of what little exists in the Cinema Treasures db. You're right. I ended up not using the Sandler reference in the Merchant Street article after all. I've used it in quite a few other NRHP-related articles, and I've got some more new sources I just checked out of the library on Saturday, incl. the splendid Pohaku book by Cheever and a dissertation on California regional (esp. Spanish Mission/Colonial) influences on HI architecture in the wake of the Panama Canal opening. The latter might mention Davis. Please add what you can to the Davis entry. I'll see what I can dig up in the Hawaiian Journal of History, which has back issues online in the UH digital repository, and I'll check my printed sources when I get home. A paragraph about the McKinley H.S. architecture might be just the ticket.

If you submit a double-DYK for Louis Davis and Merchant Street, it looks like the only intersecting images are File:Honolulu-old-Police-Station-rear.JPG and File:Honolulu-old-Police-Station-front.JPG. Which would you choose to use for a DYK? Viriditas (talk) 23:38, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

The image of the front of the old Police Station is better, just as you have it in the template.

That's what I thought you might say, which is why I included it. :) The DYK below is just an example. We don't have to use it, but you will get credit for two, not just one, if we use some factoid related to Davis and the Merchant Street district. If you can think of anything else we can source, please create your own below. Viriditas (talk) 00:06, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Would it be useful to add mention of McKinley HS being designed by the same architect in the same Spanish Colonial Revival style? Or is that unraveling the tight nexus?

I suppose anything is possible, but to get the double DYK, I was trying to focus on Davis and Merchant Street. You are welcome to add whatever you want. Try it out and see how it looks. This is, after all, your DYK! :) Viriditas (talk) 00:31, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

This is my first time to do this. I'm still a bit confused how it works. I have to run off, but will try to plug in more about Louis Davis this evening, then submit the DYKnom. Haven't turned up anything more online yet. hawaiianencyclopedia doesn't have anything new (and it's not very well proofread, anyway).

One thing I did find is a description of the Honolulu architectural period of that time (1921 to 1932). The Honolulu Police Station was built during the Mediterranean Revival Style architecture period that was popular in Honolulu.[2] Viriditas (talk) 01:11, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. I also found a page in the Cheever book about Louis Davis designing the Mediterranean-style Dept. of Agriculture Building at Keeaumoku & King St. I think I have enough now to fill out Davis. And I think I understand that the sole purpose of the DYK function is to announce substantial new additions to Wiki. BTW, I've also emailed the web & advertising coordinator at the Honolulu AIA and she asked if she could run a story in her weekly newsletter! Of course! Joel (talk) 05:44, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Okay, both entries are adequately filled out. Now what? Can I just copy and paste the Hook template info into WP:DYK? Joel (talk) 08:07, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

What hook are you talking about? The one below? Or do you have another one? If you are talking about the one below featuring the Honolulu Police Station, the Louis Davis (architect) article needs to have a reference added to that part, and the Merchent Street article needs to be checked as well. Both articles need to reflect the hook in some way, with sources. This should be fairly easy to do. Viriditas (talk) 12:02, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

I give up. DYK requires both substantive meat and an exotically sourced appetizer as a come-on? Maybe next time I put together a meaty post, I'll consider the marketing angle a bit earlier in the product development cycle. This exercise provided good incentive to add more about Louis Davis in a hurry, but now I've run out of steam on this pair of entries. On to the next projects. Joel (talk) 21:05, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

If you added the hook template below to the DYK suggestion queue without adding the references, the reviewer might fail it (or put it on hold) if they couldn't find the cited hook. All hooks have to be sourced in the articles. You've already got the material and sources; they just need to be rearranged a bit so the reviewer can see it. I asked if the hook below was acceptable or if you had another one in mind. If this one is ok, I'll try and make the changes. There are several problems so far: 1) The hook doesn't match the articles. Some references call the Police Station Mission Revival, others Spanish Colonial Revival. 2) Neither the Louis Davis or Merchant Street article properly source the hook in context. This is what needs to be tackled before submission. It should be very easy to fix this. Viriditas (talk) 22:24, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

"It should be very easy to fix this." Yes, so many things should be, but rarely are. There are multiple issues with the sloppy journalism source for the source (Burlingame) for everything except the Zamboanga Theatre parenthetical: the misnamed marble, the Alien Property Custodian named something else in his intersecting Yokohama Specie Bank article, and the more popular usage of Spanish Mission for some of what architects might distinguish as Colonial Revival (a conflation I continually encounter and am guilty of myself). Nevertheless, I've inserted the reference both before and after the Zamboanga parenthetical in the MSHD Police Station paragraph, and also inserted it after the first mention of the Police Station in Louis Davis (architect). If that does the trick, would you be good enough to submit the nom? I've lost enthusiasm and really have to move on to other things (at work). Joel (talk) 23:26, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Will do. I'm out the door right now, but will be back shortly. Viriditas (talk) 23:31, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Done. Viriditas (talk) 10:36, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Thank you very much. That's a big relief to me. Now, on to the next. Joel (talk) 18:56, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Update

The DYK is in the queue, but because I left out the word "pictured" to refer to the photo, the reviewer or updater didn't include the photo. Or at least, I think that's what happened. Perhaps it is their choice to include the photo or not, I don't know. So the DYK is scheduled for the main page, but the image didn't make it. Sorry for dropping the ball on this one. :( Viriditas (talk) 10:16, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for your persistent but patient help. Maybe I'll try the next one myself if I'm not so pressed for time. Right now I'm on the trail of the Marigold Building on Waipahu Street, whose address, as per NRIS and *everything* that derives from it, does not exist. Joel (talk) 17:42, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Ok, but I'll keep you on your toes. :) Joseph W. Podmore Building and Lemon Wond Holt are almost ready to go (just shy of DYK length I believe) and need a small expansion. Obviously you could get the double with Lemon Wond Holt House, but that one needs more expansion, so I see three DYK's right off the bat. I'll see if I can help. Viriditas (talk) 01:42, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Edgar and Lucy Henriques House is long enough for DYK. Viriditas (talk) 08:03, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Time ran too short on that one. How about Malia_(Hawaiian_canoe)? The second sentence might be an adequate hook. Joel (talk) 03:19, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

See below. Viriditas (talk) 12:07, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Malia (Hawaiian canoe)

• ... that the wooden hull of the 1933 Malia (Hawaiian canoe) provided the founding model for all subsequent outrigger canoeing hulls, including those later molded from fiberglass?

Created by Joel Bradshaw (talk). Self nom at 03:31, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

•   Malia (Hawaiian canoe) – Joel Bradshaw (give) (tag)

Okay. I self-nominated this one--correctly, I hope. We'll see how it goes. Joel (talk) 03:43, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

You're going to want to fix the DYK to remove the disambiguation term (Hawaiian canoe) and add italics. We generally pipe those out in a link (remember, Louis Davis (architect) became Louis Davis). So, you would want to change it to something like this:

... that the koa wood hull of a Hawaiian-style outrigger canoe named Mālia became the mold for modern fiberglass racing canoes?

Obviously, you can play around with the variations there, but you don't want the dab in the DYK. In any case, remember to check the character count is under the 200 limit. You might want to make a few more changes, such as condensing to remove repetition. You use the word "hull" twice, which probably isn't necessary, and I'm not clear why you use "outrigger canoeing" instead of just "outrigger canoe". And, "provided the founding model" is a real mouthful, so maybe you could shorten that as well. But hey, play around with it and see what you can do. It's also a good idea to cleanup the citation you are using for the hook; Most reviewers won't have any idea that KANUculture is notable as a RS, so you want to hold their hands by formatting a full citation. Looking online, I see better references for this material, such as The Hawaiian Canoe (1993) by Tommy Holmes. There is also some confusion about the data. The tree for the canoe was apparently felled and completed somewhere between 1933-1934 by James Yamazaki. Viriditas (talk) 13:35, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

All good points, and I did leave the ref out of the DYK. "Outrigger canoeing" redirects to "outrigger canoe racing"; there is a huge variety of outrigger canoes across the world, and none but modern racing canoes derive from the Malia. Joel (talk) 18:49, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Hmmm, I don't know. Holmes and others report that Malia was duplicated without authorization, and describes it as piracy. The mold was made without permission, allegedly. He says it was one of the prototypes for modern racing canoes. Viriditas (talk) 02:40, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for all you're doing to improve the article. Joel (talk) 23:47, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Louis Davis (architect)

On June 14, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Louis Davis (architect), which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Mifter (talk) 17:28, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Merchant Street Historic District

On June 14, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Merchant Street Historic District, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Mifter (talk) 17:28, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Malia (Hawaiian canoe)

On June 26, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Malia (Hawaiian canoe), which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Wizardman 14:36, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Salut!

Văd că cunoşti limba română.

Te invit să participi şi la Wikipedia în limba română!

Toate cele bune!--FeodorBezuhov (talk) 09:02, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Mulţumesc foarte mult. În acest moment sunt extrem de preocupat cu alte proiecte (având de a face mai ales cu Hawaii şi Japonia), însǎ sper sǎ fiu de folos mai târziu. Pentru mine, e mult mai uşor sǎ traduc din românǎ în englezǎ decât vice versa. Joel (talk) 18:46, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Fire Stations of Oahu

Good job with this, but remember that citing dissertations on Wikipedia (Penkiunas) can be problematic as they are generally considered unpublished research. I'll try and look into this further. Viriditas (talk) 09:27, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Penkiunas is actually published and available in libraries. My copy from the state library has been checked out dozens of times. It's quite a favorite. I'll add a note (Ann Arbor: UMI, 1993) after the biblio entry. Joel (talk) 18:49, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

BTW, I've repeatedly found that other users have removed my NRHP and "Buildings in ..." categories from my photos in the Commons. The latest calls himself Gödeke (in Germany), who's into fire stations, but not much else, it seems. Joel (talk) 19:11, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Just saw this. I'll take a look at commons now. Viriditas (talk) 12:00, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, that's weird. He hasn't been active in almost several months, so there's not much we can do right now, but if it happens again, let me know. Viriditas (talk) 12:07, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Wiki Epistemology

Yesterday I finally pulled together a blogpost about the kinds of problems I've been encountering with the published sources I've been using on WP NRHP and WP Hawaii project work. I'll be off-line for a few weeks traveling in Japan. Joel (talk) 16:08, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Re: Talk:Thomas Alexander Burningham House

Hey, Joel. thanks for all the good work you are doing on these articles. Quick question for you: Why are you adding your signature to the talk page? Any non-commentary on the talk page (such as adding a project template) appears attributed to you in the edit history. Viriditas (talk) 19:53, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

I have just been following the suggestion at the top of every talk page edit box "remember to sign your posts by typing four tildes (Joel (talk) 17:02, 17 August 2009 (UTC))"! If it's not needed when adding project templates, I'll be happy to desist. I often forget to sign those anyway. I can see how they might clutter up my audit trail.

Photo request: Honolulu-based airline headquarters

Hi! Is Honolulu Airport convenient to your location? If so, would you mind photographing the headquarters of Hawaiian Airlines and posting it in the article? The article needs a photograph of the airline headquarters, and I would appreciate it if you uploaded a photo of the headquarters facility. Since the Aloha Air Cargo headquarters and the Island Air headquarters are by Honolulu Airport as well, would you mind photographing that building as well?

The reason why I would like to have these images is because I have made an effort to get photographs of airline headquarters from around the world; I found a lot on Flickr, for instance. On Flickr I found the headquarters of American Airlines, United Airlines, British Airways, etc. However, none of the three Honolulu-based airlines have images of their headquarters on Flickr, so I would appreciate it if you photographed the buildings.

Thanks in advance, WhisperToMe (talk) 20:46, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Okay, I'll see what I can do. Joel (talk) 16:45, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

ro:Limba maghiară

Mă adresez ţie pentru că eşti lingvist şi ştii româneşte, iar pe ro.wp nu prea sunt lingvişti. Am scris o serie de articole despre ro:limba maghiară şi aş avea nevoie de părerea ta ca lingvist despre modul de prezentare a limbii, chiar dacă nu o cunoşti. Mulţumesc anticipat. ro:user:Amator linguarum —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.114.10.53 (talk) 17:42, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

Liljestrand House

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Oahu Cemetery

Hello, I noticed you had a picture of Oahu cemetery, so I used that in the article I just wrote. Quite a number of notable people there. We are having a debate, however, about if the "Nuuanu Cemetery" is the same place or "completely different". As far as I can tell, the old part is officially called "Oahu Cemetery", but since the addition in 1949 the area is often called "Nuuanu" after the valley it is in. If you are still available, please take a look at: Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Numismatics#The_sources_can.27t_agree_on_the_location_of_the_event mahalo. W Nowicki (talk) 18:45, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

• It's a bit confusing because several cemeteries run into each other along Nuuanu Ave: Oahu Cemetery at 2162 Nuuanu Avenue (on the left side of Nuuanu Ave, facing uphill), Nuuanu Memorial Park & Mortuary at 2233 Nuuanu Ave (one block mauka on Nuuanu Ave, and across the street), Honolulu Memorial at 22 Craigside Place (across Nuuanu Ave from Oahu Cemetery), and the Royal Mausoleum State Monument at 2261 Nuuanu Ave (at the mauka end of Nuuanu Memorial Park). Joel (talk) 23:52, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for all our help on this, above and beyond the call of duty. As for your offer of pictures, looks like you have many, but might take some digging to find articles that need them. Some perhaps might be the notable burials in Oahu Cemetery and use pics of their grave sites if we cannot find public domain ones. For example, the early governors, etc. e.g. Andrew Auld — George R. Carter — Benjamin Dillingham — Kenneth Emory — Victor S. K. Houston — John Papa Īī (there is a pic on-line but not sure it is PD) — Lawrence M. Judd — Lincoln Loy McCandless — Joseph Rock — Ingram Stainback — Horace Worth Vaughan and the pic of the crematory looks somewhat back-lit, so taken at a time when the sun is at your back would look better. But these all can be done whenever of course. And if we could get someone like Bishop or Mission House (or state archives for that matter) to let us use their pix that would be even better. I have tossed around the idea of seeing if I could make a small donation to one of the non-profits to fund a student doing some scanning and uploading, for example. Not sure if everyone would agree to buy into that. When I asked Parker Ranch for example they did not want to cooperate (and they are for-profit). Mahalo W Nowicki (talk) 18:05, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

You're welcome. I took the crematory photo on a misty, rainy day. The next time we visit there I'll see if I can improve it. But in the meantime, I'm concentrating on NRHP images and entries. In fact, I plan to shoot a bunch of photos for upload to Wiki Commons during our Thanksgiving weekend visit to Kauai, for which there are a lot of accessible NRHP sites, but few photos in Wiki. Joel (talk) 18:55, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

Hope you enjoyed your trip. I did some work on the Russian Fort Elizabeth a while back, but Kauaʻi sites of course need more work. Especially embarassing is the stub for the Cook Landing Site (Waimea, Hawai'i) since that event was quite pivotal. I think there is a plaque at the actual site across the river from the fort ruins?

Also if you did not notice, I found the 1941 Polk book online, but never would have thought of it without your help. Mahalo. W Nowicki (talk) 02:49, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Chasing NRHP sites around Kauaʻi was great. Some of the sites were rather elusive and a few others were inaccessible, but we got photos of nearly 30 of the 37 sites, and lots else besides. I should have been working on other stuff today, but can't resist uploading a bunch of the photos and linking them. Joel (talk) 03:10, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Pics

Thanks for all the pics. Here is a request. I heard there is a painting in the Royal Mausoleum depicting Hoʻolulu and Hoapili. I am working on bios of these two, and a pic of course would be great, although not sure photos are allowed inside. Any chance you have one? W Nowicki (talk) 03:30, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

I've never gone into the Royal Mausoleum and don't have any photos. I'll put in on my list of walking tours, but it doesn't seem to be open on weekends. Maybe I can go there during my upcoming holiday time off. Joel (talk) 05:48, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Whenever, not even sure they allow photos inside. Plenty of work to do in the meanwhile, thanks. W Nowicki (talk) 17:34, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Ulu Po Heiau

Happy New Year. Is this the right name for this article? What about Ulupo Heiau State Historic Site? Viriditas (talk) 12:28, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

The NPS recorded it as Ulu Po Heiau, and all the other NRHP heiau are similarly named, one of which is just called Small Heiau! It would probably be better just to forward Ulu Po Heiau to Ulupo Heiau, and to do the same for Small Heiau after we find out what it is now called. I've also been overridden before when trying to change the names on the NRHP listings to those more commonly used, like replacing Alexander and Baldwin Building with Alexander & Baldwin Building, since the company lists its own name as A&B with an ampersand. So my policy is to take the listing names as they are, but to respell them and add diacritics as needed when I create the actual articles. That seems to be common practice for others, too. BTW, I self-nominated Kukaniloko Birth Site to DYK for 28 December. Joel (talk) 17:04, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Me too chiming in here: I would favor creating the article with the broader name, as suggested, e.g. Ulupo Heiau State Historic Site and then just doing a redirect page from the NRHP listing name. That way the strange names used by the NRHP can stay in the table articles (otherwise certain admins revert them, I found out the hard way). For example, I just did an article on the Bond family and put in a redirect for "Bond District" which was the NRHP name. And as usual the coords are off in the NRHP and the "focus" form needs to be used as a source, etc. but you are probably in the middle of this. Thanks. W Nowicki (talk) 19:54, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

I think a simple Ulupo Heiau is a better article title than one adding 'State Historical Site'. It gives much greater latitude for enlargement and historical background before HI was ever a state (or kingdom), like Elias Bond vs. Bond District. Joel (talk) 03:50, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

I'm confused. That article should be called Bond District, not Elias Bond. Viriditas (talk) 05:56, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

After taking a closer look at the Bond article, I think it might be better to separate it into two: Elias Bond and Bond District, each with its own infobox. Joel (talk) 00:18, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

(Perhaps this discussions should on its talk page?) Anyway, I thought so too at first, but could not come up with a good split. And perhaps I was burned by my experience on the Wilkes Campsite article, which got merged into Mauna Loa, even though I thought there was a clear split. They accused me of "content forking". In this case, the only notable things that Elias Bond did were in this district, and the only notable people to live there were the Bond family. So you either have two articles that duplicate most of the text, or just a stub (e.g. biobox only?) and point to the other one. IMO there are far too many stubs already; as a reader I prefer one integrated article that has a full narrative to a multitude of stubs.

In the future if, say, the church gets rebuilt or the New Moon center opens, there might be something additional that becomes notable and they might be split apart some day, with the Elias Bond article just talking about that person's history and probably the homestead, or whatever. But so far the subjects seem inter-twined. I thought one article was an improvement over zero.

Now what to call the article was a diferent question. I started out developing it as "Bond District" and the lead section still reads that way. The name sounded too general. A google search http://www.google.com/search?q=bond+district for example gives over fifteen million hits. There are also a few people named Elias Bond, but the only notable one I found was a 17-century English member of parliament in Wareham (UK Parliament constituency). So you could over-rule if you think that would be worth it, but there might be more pressing issues in the project. For example, I just ran across the page Kalakua Kaheiheimaile which I think is a mis-spelling of Kalākua Kaheiheimālie. W Nowicki (talk) 19:50, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Kukaniloko Birth Site

Hello! Your submission of Kukaniloko Birth Site at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Calmer Waters 03:53, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Kukaniloko Birth Site

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More pics

Aloha, looks like you went to the big island for a while? Thanks for filling in the missing pics. I still have a few left from our stay in Kona that I have yet to upload. I also did one of the Masonic Hall (I think) but it looks ugly today due to wires etc.

Actually, I commissioned my daughter to snap a few of the Hilo buildings that needed photos when she was there during the holidays. Her shot of the old Masonic Lodge wasn't that great either. I think it needs to be taken from the opposite street corner, so as to get 2 sides of the bldg, but that means more wires. The building is for sale and the online photos of the inside are quite impressive. Joel (talk) 20:27, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Also I am working up a series on the Baldwin family. Do you have any of their Lahaina house (part of the historic district I think), their other estates, Hamakua Ditch, Makawao Church or Haʻikū Mill for example? Mahalo. W Nowicki (talk) 18:54, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Maui is on our to-go-again list before long, and I'll definitely look to fill NRHP photo gaps when we go. I still have some Kauai photos to upload for articles that still need to be started (like the Mission District in Hanalei). Joel (talk) 20:27, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

I looked up my Hilo pics and uploaded the one I had, File:Hilo Masonic Lodge Hall.jpg since it did show two sides of the building. No article yet. As of June it was just "for lease" (seems the restaurant closed? may be another one there now) Also ran across a pic of Clarence Hyde Cooke so added that to the article. Eventually of course we need to do all the "big five" families, but there were so many children and inter-marriage it gets daunting. I used a HABS photo for the Baldwin house for now.

Do you happen to have any shots of Hualalai? Mine are all voggy. People are saying the picture on the page is really mauna kea, which it could be. W Nowicki (talk) 00:18, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for those two pics, and for fixing up the C. H. Cooke article, which I only decided to do because I had a bit of a bio at my fingertips in the NRHP record. I'm sorry I don't have any more pics from the other islands. Just a bunch for Oahu and Kauai for more ambitious articles I'll write someday when I have more time (Chinatown Historic District, Hawaii Capital Historic District, Waioli Mission District). It's been too voggy lately to take better pics of Oahu Cemetery and other sites. By the end of this month I have to slow down on WP Hawaii & WP NRHP work and buckle down on a longer-term linguistic project.

Thanks for the offer of more pics. I would say the downtown Lahaina ones might be highest priority. The Waiola Church cemetery for example has some great old grave sites e.g. Keōpūolani. I now did a bio of William Richards and I think his grave is there. The current church is from 1953 but still a contributing property I think. Hale Aloha has been rebuilt but there is no separate article yet on it. Maria Lanakila Catholic Church has article but no pic. Mokuʻula is supposed to be in the process of being restored, but all we have so far is a pic of the plaque. Haiku Mill is private, but an outside pic should be doable. Of course a modern outside shot of Makawao Union Church (just an old grainy one now). There is evidently an old Maui High School (Kahului, Hawaii) which is now a ruin in the middle of former cane fields. Somehow its nomination to NRHP was denied, perhaps because it is being reconstructed? But the new school in Wailuku is listed. There are also ruins of a Hamakuapoko Mill but it does not seem to be on NRHP (I think has some boring HABS photos). If you can get up to Lahainaluna a building there is on NRHP. A few more old schools too, but any of the above would keep us busy for a while. Thanks again, W Nowicki (talk) 00:18, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Okay, I've got the NRHP nomination form for LHD, which lists all the buildings, so that'll be top priority. I hope I can also get a shot of the Lahainaluna bldg while I'm on that side. When I was shooting buildings at Punahou, a guard came over to tell me it was forbidden. Fortunately I had already got a lot of good shots of the Vladimir Ossipoff chapel and the president's home (by Oliver G. Traphagen) on the upper campus. It'll be great if I can get some interior shots of the Gomes House. Joel (talk) 00:44, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Yes, one needs to be careful shooting schools and U.S. Post offices so as not to be accused of a child molester or terrorist. I also got complained to taking a shot of Parker Ranch, since it is still private and not even NRHP. It seems Hale Paʻi is a museum, so might be easier (although sometimes they complain too, certainly indoors). Actually I have a couple old images for them already, even if we split off the Hale from the main school article. I see Puunene School is on NRHP but the sugar museum and mill there are not. Enjoy your trip! W Nowicki (talk) 04:00, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Jonathan Smith Green

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okinas etc

Hi, could you please participate at Talk:National Register of Historic Places listings in Hawaii#official names and okinas. Or, can I take it you accept current tentative consensus that points numbered 1 and 3 are acceptable to all, there? It would be helpful if you would indicate either way, there. Thanks! --doncram (talk) 18:01, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

Intersecting

Hello, evidently you noticed I wrote up the Waioli Mission District‎ since you had the picture already. I was doing the Alexander family, so had the NRHP nomination in my browser. Those Alexanders really got around. Too bad they did not get Bonus Miles for all those trips. :-) They also touched at Wailuku and of course are related to the Baldwins, Cookes, and Dickey. Working on Castle family a bit, but have not started Cookes, or Wilcox. The location of Waioli is a bit wrong in the table. I can fix that if you do not get around to it. The road is 560 now, for example, right? W Nowicki (talk) 02:31, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. Yeah, I was happy to see you already created the article, so now I can upload some more photos to illustrate it. I also took a bunch of shots of Oahu Cemetery last Sunday, so have headstones of Stainback, Atherton, Carter, Judd, and others, plus a sunny shot of the crematorium and chapel (and a sign that says "Ultimate Cremation Services of Hawaii"! I've also just received a new book on Hart Wood and Hawaiian Regional architecture from UH Press. When Wood worked on the restoration of the Waioli Mission Hall and Mission House, he was apparently struck by the stark contrast between the locally adapted Hall and the New England "saltbox" house. The old hall at Waioli was the prototype for what later became known as the Dickey roof. I also took quite a few Royal Mausoleum shots last month, but nothing inside I'm afraid. Joel (talk) 16:30, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, a pic of the house might go in the Alexander article too. There is an "Alexander House" in Wailuku I think, but was named after him later.

Maybe the crematorium could advertise "no customer complaints". I bet their "business is hot". That reminds me there was a sketch of Hoʻolulu by Arago I should add. At least fairly sure he is the one, given the spelling in French. I got the "John Young" book, which should help on the early history, but on other projects for a while. W Nowicki (talk) 18:28, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

I uploaded and linked a few photos of tombstones in Oahu Cemetery this morning: Alexander Cartwright, Samuel C. Damon, Wallace Rider Farrington, Joseph Rider Farrington, Elizabeth Pruett Farrington. More to come.

That is great, thanks. Steady progress on these. I used the HABS picture for the James D. Dole Homestead but of course if you ever get there a color one would be nice. The nom form uses future tense to say it "will be" moved to the Waipahu Cultural Garden, but no idea if it was, or is destroyed. Also need to track down how and if Belle Dickey is related to the others. W Nowicki (talk) 00:36, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

I'm scheduled to go to Waipahu on Saturday, Sept. 25th, to interview Goro Arakawa and get a personal tour of historic Waipahu. He was instrumental in establishing the Cultural Garden and in preserving the old sugar mill stack. I'll try to see if he can help me get a shot of the Dole Homestead. Joel (talk) 01:54, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Great! and I do now think Belle Dickey was C. W.'s sister, so all seems connected now. If we do an article on the Waipahu Garden or Village Plantation or whatever it is called (web site is down?) maybe the NRHP box should go there? Mahalo. W Nowicki (talk)

Lihue PO pic

U.S. Post Office-Lihue

Thanks! --doncram (talk) 02:05, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

DYK nomination for Dr. Archibald Neil Sinclair House

Hello, your nomination of Dr. Archibald Neil Sinclair House at DYK was reviewed and comments provided.--NortyNort (Holla) 22:01, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Thank you. I replied at its DYK nomination entry, with two working links -- here and National Register of Historic Places listings in Oahu -- verifying the house's NRHP status. Both NR servers seem to be offline right now. Joel (talk) 02:22, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Please see response I just made there. — Rlevse • Talk • 10:07, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

DYK for George D. Oakley House

— Rlevse • Talk • 00:04, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Dr. Archibald Neil Sinclair House

— Rlevse • Talk • 12:38, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Kauai Museum

I was doing work on the Wilcox family so spun off an article on the building of which you already had a photo. Took the liberty of putting it in a DYK nom too, but I will going out of town without Internet access for a week starting Friday. You don't have one of the Wilcox Hanalei house? W Nowicki (talk) 22:35, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

Good work! I had linked to the beach house photo from the NRHP in Kauaʻi listing, so I just added the link at your infobox for the house under Albert Spencer Wilcox. I'll monitor the DYK listings in case I can address any queries the screeners turn up. BTW, I got photos of the Wakamiya Inari Shrine at the Waipahu Cultural Garden and will create an article on it today. But also ascertained that the James D. Dole Homestead is not there (or no longer there), apparently because Dole represents management, not labor! The Plantation Village focuses on the workers, not the owners. The homestead may have been shipped off to the mainland. Enjoy your trip! Joel (talk) 00:11, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, did not realize it was already in the table. If you did not notice, I put a better one (I think) of the Hanalei Pier in the table too by cropping a larger color pic someone had downloaded. The beach house pic looks a little odd in the middle of a bio article, but there is not much to say about the house in a separate article. The nom does not even say when it was built, or who designed it, etc.? W Nowicki (talk) 02:28, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

ʻIolani Palace

Hello, as a linguist your position on the ʻokina in this title would be appreciated. Twice in the past week it has been moved to use an English apostrophe character instead. Do you agree with this? Your comment would be appreciated on the Talk:'Iolani Palace page. Thanks. W Nowicki (talk) 18:23, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for File:AsianTheatreJournal.gif

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Invitation to join WikiProject United States

Hello, Joel Bradshaw! WikiProject United States, an outreach effort supporting development of United States related articles in Wikipedia, has recently been restarted after a long period of inactivity. As a user who has shown an interest in United States related topics we wanted to invite you to join us in developing content relating to the United States. If you are interested please add your Username and area of interest to the members page here. Thank you!!!

--Kumioko (talk) 20:12, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

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Journal of World History

Hello Joel,

I was wondering where you got the print circulation numbers of the Journal of World History of 2008 from? I was thinking of using them for a Dutch article on the journal and wanted to know if the same source provided numbers of other years. --Cruon (talk) 10:36, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

WikiProject Romania

Hi! From your edits, it looks like you might be interested in contributing to WikiProject Romania. It is a project aimed at organizing and improving the quality and accuracy of articles related to Romania. Thanks and best regards!

--Codrin.B (talk) 05:43, 21 January 2012 (UTC)

Mulţumesc, însă sunt prea preocupat în prezent cu alte proiecte (mai ales cele lingvistice). Joel (talk) 19:58, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

NRHP Kualoa Ahupua'a Historical District

I wonder if you could help clear something up. The above Kualoa Hist Dist is listed on National Register of Historic Places listings in Oahu. The NPS website has not caught up with the old listings, and this one is from 1974, so I don't have that detail. Kualoa Ranch page says the ranch land is the listing. While researching Kualoa Regional Park, I found references, such as this 2004 Advertiser article that say the park itself is listed on NRHP. Do you know the answer? Is it possible that both the ranch and the park are included in the historic district? Or, is it just one or the other? Maile66 (talk) 21:45, 15 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi, Maile. I believe the historic district embraces the whole ahupua‘a. Windward residents were putting a lot of private lands on the NRHP during the 1970s in order to limit the rampant development of those years. Note the accession dates of Moli‘i Pond, which abuts Kualoa Park, as well as Bellows, several fishponds from Kahalu‘u to Kahuku, and several heiau. I think that's one reason Kualoa Ranch hasn't been turned into a big residential resort. But I haven't seen the actual documents, either. Joel (talk) 18:54, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Oahu Wiknic on June 23rd

Aloha! I am planning to set up an Oahu Wikinic for June 23, as described at Wikipedia:Wiknic

My Wikipedia user name is Peaceray, I started about 15 months ago, & I have about 2,500 edits on en.wikipedia.org. I have been hankering to meet with some fellow local Wikipedians, especially since a few of us live in Kailua. To that end, I am sending email to or posting on the user Talk pages of 19 of us from the Wikipedia:WikiProject Hawaii/Participants page who I could identify as possibly living on Oahu.

Please see Wikipedia:Meetup/Oahu/1 & Wikipedia talk:Meetup/Oahu/1

I am open to any of the locations mentioned in the post, or other alternatives. I am like-to-operate-by-consensus type of guy, any workable location on which we could soon decide would be great!

Mahalo, Peaceray (talk) 23:09, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

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Central Middle School (Honolulu, Hawaii)

Hello, Joel Bradshaw, and thank you for your contributions!

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Honolulu cemetery

Hello, I noticed your photos of Oahu Cemetery tombstones. Do you still live in Honolulu? Would you mind taking a photograph of Franklin Seaver Pratt and his wife Elizabeth Kekaaniau Pratt (her gravestone is here but I can't use this one because I didn't take the photo)? I am also doing some articles on the Sumner, who were buried in the Catholic cemetery and Beckley, who were buried at Oahu cemetery, families of Hawaii.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 22:06, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I am at your service. I already have a photo on Flickr of the marker for a J.K. Sumner and Princess Eugenie Ninito Sumner from the Catholic Cemetery. Do you want me to upload it to Wikimedia Commons? I'll see if I can find and photograph Pratt and Beckley gravemarkers in Oahu Cemetery. I recently took some photos of the 1899 Pratt Residence on Pacific Heights Road. Is that the same family? I'll be happy to add my Flickr photos to Wikimedia Commons if they're of use to you. Joel (talk) 22:57, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

No wrong Pratt...Thank you very much, I've actually stumbled upon some of your photos on flickr. Ninito's image will be helpful since I have been working on an article for Ninito for a while now, but haven't gotten around to finishing it. Could you also upload these images from your flickr account: [3], [4], [5], and [6]?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 00:13, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

• 
• 
  Grave marker for Bishops Koeckemann and Boeynaems, Vicars Apostolic, Honolulu Catholic Cemetery, King St., Honolulu
• 
  Block headstones of Freemasons, Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu
• 
  Grave marker: "Capt. James A. King / Born Dec. 4. 1833. Bridge of Allen. N.B. / Died October 16. 1899. Mokapu Point." Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu
• 
  William Keolaloa K. Sumner tombstone, Catholic Cemetery, Honolulu, Hawaii
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  Princess Eugenie Ninito Sumner tombstone, Catholic Cemetery, Honolulu, Hawaii

If you are ever around the Catholic cemetery, please look for Ninito's other families members who are probably interred there: her brother-in-law was William K. Sumner who died of leprosy in the 1880s, father-in-law Captain William Sumner of Northampton (1786-1847), her nieces Nancy Sumner Ellis (1839-1895) or any member of the Ellis family, Elizabeth Keawepo‘o‘ole Sumner (1850-1911) (she was married three times under the names Chapman, Achuck and Lapana; the last is probably the name she used on a tombstone) or Elizabeth's daughter Mauli Keawepooole, who died in 1899, according to a Hawaiian newspaper she was buried there. And if your around Oahu Cemetery, could you see if you can find a Captain George C. Beckley; he died in 1825 or 1826 and according to Bishop Henry Bond Restarick he was buried there. Thanks again. --KAVEBEAR (talk) 00:13, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

Okay, here are two Sumner grave markers in the Catholic Cemetery on King Street in Honolulu. Couldn't find any Ellises or other likely relatives. And two Pratt grave markers from Oahu Cemetery. And several Beckley grave markers, but none for Captain George, only his brother(?) Frederick. Joel (talk) 07:11, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

• 
  Tombstone of High Chiefess Elizabeth Kekaaniau Laanui Pratt (1834-1928) in Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu
• 
  Tombstone of Franklin Seaver Pratt (1829-1894) in Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu
• 
  Tombstone of Frederick Beckley (1787-1827) in Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu
• 
  Tombstone of George H. Kahea Beckley (1888-1924) in Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu
• 
  Tombstone of Maria A. Kahaawelani Beckley Kahea (1847-1909) in Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu
• 
  Three tombstones in the Beckley plot in Oahu Cemetery, Honolulu

Thank you very much. You did a great job. Was Frederick Beckley by himself or buried next to the other Beckleys? His birth and death dates matches up exactly with Captain George Charles Beckley! Iwonder if the people in the 1900s messed up the name when they moved his remains from their original place in the Kawaihao vaults.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 07:18, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

The Beckleys were all in one big, mostly empty plot in the extreme northeast (mauka Diamond Head) corner of the cemetery, but spread out and facing different directions. So I suppose someone might have gotten the name wrong. Frederick W. Beckley (1845-1881) in the three-tombstone photo was likely to be the grandson of the Frederick Beckley at the bottom left corner of the plot. Tombstones of those who died in the 1800s face the sea/south; those who died in the 1900s face Nuuanu Ave./east). Joel (talk) 01:25, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

Thank you!--KAVEBEAR (talk) 01:56, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

Julia Alapai

Is photography allowed at Hānaiakamālama? If so would it be possible for you to get a a decent photograph of the painting in the piano parlor of Queen Emma's aunt Julia Alapai? I've contacted the palace and the Daughter of Hawaii two or three years ago and they just don't reply. Also I don't know if there are knowledgable tour guides or not but any information about the time period or artist of the artwork and maybe the life of Julia (also called Juliana) Alapai would be nice. --KAVEBEAR (talk) 06:17, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

I visited there with camera in hand, got the inside tour, and took some outside shots of the grounds, but must have been advised against taking photos inside, because I don't have any. Joel (talk) 17:26, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

I thought that would have been the case. Thanks anyway.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 21:21, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

Wilcox cemetery

Any possibility you could take some seperate high quality close up shots of each of these four individuals on this monument at Robert William Wilcox's grave in the Catholic cemetery? Just focus on the photos not the words, and another one with them all would be good too. There might be a problem with the enclosure in the way, though.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 18:57, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Also if you don't mind could you keep an eye for these four: HS Swinton, Napae M. Swinton, James Auld, and Wm (William) Wahinepio Buckle (1826 - 1881).--KAVEBEAR (talk) 19:21, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Okay, I've got shots of the Swinton and Buckle (1826-1884) headstones. Couldn't find Auld this time. But I'm afraid my shots of the faces on the Wilcox obelisk were no better than those already available in Wiki. The Robert Wilcox gravesite is also *much* more elaborate now than it is in the mid-2000s photo near the bottom of the Wiki article. Joel (talk) 18:14, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

I'm curious. What do you mean *much* more elaborate. Please describe. I would love to know. Thanks.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 06:46, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

See photo.Joel (talk) 20:55, 4 June 2014 (UTC)

Robert William Wilcox family plot, Roman Catholic Cemetery, King St., Honolulu, Hawaii

Oh interesting. Thanks. Whoa. I think it look like this in 2004. --KAVEBEAR (talk) 03:25, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

I was in Japan in July, but will get around to revisiting the cemetery with camera in hand one of these weekends. Joel (talk) 20:17, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Nomination of Japan Baptist Association for deletion

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January 2014

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Kawaiahao Church

Aloha. I was wondering if you can help me can pictures of the Kapena Family Plot in the Kawaiahao Church cemetery. I have old newspaper from 1868 calling it a tomb but findagrave calls it a family plot, so I don't know if there is a structure over it or is it just a plot of graves together. Could you get an overarching picture of the entire family plot or tomb and each individual grave markers of six individuals in the plot:

1. KUPUNA- KAPENA 1868 [7]
2. E.A. KAPENA DIED APRIL 18, 1880 [8]
3. J. M. KAPENA DIED OCT. 23- 1887 [9]
4. KAPUNA UMIUIMI - 1894
5. DAVID KALU 1897
6. KAHOIHOI PAHU- 1893.

• 
  David Kalu, d. 1897
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  E. A. Kapena, d. 18 Apr 1880
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  J. M. Kapena, d. 23 Oct 1887
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  Kahoihoi Pahu, d. 1893
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  Kupuna Kapena, d. 1868
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  Kupuna Umiuimi, d. 1894
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  Kapena family tomb & plot
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  W. Hoapili Ka‘auwai, b. 1824, d. April 1874
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  G. Kaleiwohi Ka‘auwai, b. 1831, d. March 1881, and Muolo Ka‘auwai Keaweheulu, b. 1848, d. 11 March 1911
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  Kamokuiki, d. 1840
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  Kuhio Nui and Alapai Nui
• 
  Ka‘auwai family obelisk (with Kapena family tomb & plot behind it)

The first cowrote Hawaii's first constitution with Boaz Mahune and William Richards, the second was an important government minister during Kalakaua reign, the third is the daughter of David Malo. This list might help you locate them.

There is also a four sided monument with names: front: G. KALEIWOHI KAAUWAI BORN 1831 DIED MARCH 1881, MUOLOKAAUWAIKEAWEAHEULU BORN 1848 DEID MARCH 11, 1911IN MOMORIUM OF; left side KAMOKUIKI DIED 1840; right side: W. HOAPILI KAAUWAI BORN 1824 DIED APRIL 1874; back: KUHIO NUI, ALAPAI NUI. These are relatives of King Kalakaua, Queen Kapiolani and Prince Kuhio.

Thank you so much. They look perfect!--KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:59, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

Also if you can find these other markers:

Gravestone of Salai Hiwauli, wife of John K. Ii, in Kawaiaha‘o Church cemetery, Honolulu, Hawaii. Engraved in Hawaiian: He mea hoomanao ia (in memory of) / SALAI HIWAULI. / wahine a Ioane Ii (wife of John Ii) / Make i Nawiliwili Kauai (died at ...) / Aug. 29, 1856. / Hanau i Kahaluu Oahu (born at ...) / Sept. 14, 1804 / Kona mau Makahiki a pau (her duration of life) / 51 mak. 11 mal. 15 la. (51 yr. (makahiki) 11 mo. (malama) 15 days (la))

1. One marker for Ululani A A Haalelea (1842-1908) and Levi Haalelea (1828- 1864) and Richard Haalilio (1808- 1844). [Phttp://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=pv&GRid=24411214&PIpi=44947148 icture]
2. HE MEA HOOMANAO IA SALAI HIWAULI WAHINE A IOANE LI MAKE I NAWAILILI, KAUAI AUG. 29,1856 HONAU I KAHALUU, OAHU SEPT 14,1804 KONA MAU MAKAHIKI A PAU [10]
3. HE HOOMANAO NO PAULO KANOA A ME KANA MOU WAHINE O KA PAU A ME KAHANAAUWAI [11]
4. HOOMANAO IA P.P. KANOA MAKE MA HONOLULU MARCH 18, 1895 A ME KALEIPUA KONA WAHINE MAKE MA HONOLULU SEPT. 21, 1847 []
5. SACRED TO THE MEMORY OF J. Y. OLOHANA DAVIS BORN AT KAWAIHAE AUG. 21, 1828 DIED AT HONOLULU SEPT. 6,1885 AGED 57 YEARS
6. NOBLE JUNIUS KAAE BORN AT LAHINA SEPT. 17, 1845 DIED AT HONOLULU DEC. 19, 1906 MOE IKE KAPU [12]

These are all in that list. And I added the examples of ones I could find online, which are unfree images from findagrave. Thanks in advance.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 05:57, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

Lunalilo Mausoleum

Also if you are allow to take photographs or even be allowed inside Lunalilo's Mausoleum could you please get pictures of a gravestone on the grounds of Lunalilo's tomb with the inscription "Auhea Kekauluohi, 1839-1899." Also, "William Bishop Taylor, April 28, 1882 — May 20, 1956." Mention in this article by a Hautman. It's Lunalilo's cousin and one of the first kahu of the Mausoleum and her grandson Wiilliam Bishop Taylor. Thanks.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 22:21, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

Hawaii edit-a-thon!

Hello. I'm interested in attempting to put together an edit-a-thon for Hawaiian cultural topics something during the Makahiki festival perhaps around the month of November. The hope is that our lackluster coverage of Hawaiian mythology could be improved with help from the Bishop Museum, Hawaii Pacific University, and the Honolulu public library. I am in the process of making initial contacts with these organizations as well as Wikimedia DC's GLAM project. If this sounds like something you might be interested in participating in, or perhaps helping to coordinate, could you please add your name to 2014 Makahiki Edit-a-thon?--v/r - TP 21:23, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

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Hawai‘i Sons of the Civil War

Hello, can you possibly be able to take a photograph of this plaque commemorating the Hawai‘i Sons of the Civil War? Thanks.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 16:28, 4 December 2014 (UTC)

Okay. I finally got a chance to photograph the plaque, but I can't find any place to insert it in Wikipedia. Joel (talk) 17:05, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

Thanks! James Wood Bush#Memorial. I plan to write a few more memorials on Hawaii Civil War veterans. --KAVEBEAR (talk) 00:31, 2 August 2015 (UTC)

Henry Hoolulu Pitman's article can use it too!--KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:22, 2 August 2015 (UTC)

Okay, I added the memorial image and caption to each of those two articles. Joel (talk) 11:46, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

Looking for editors to help with an Asian Pacific American edit-a-thon in Honolulu

On Oahu? Edit Wikipedia or Wikimedia sister projects? You are invited to help the Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center with an Asian Pacific American edit-a-thon in Honolulu this September.

Aloha!

Last summer I moved to the Seattle area after 14 years in Kailua on Oahu. I immediately fell in with the Cascadia Wikimedians User Group as it formed, joined its board and became its first president as well as the GLAM representative for Washington State.

Recently, Adriel Luis, Curator (Digital & Emerging Media) at the Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center, contacted me about setting up an edit-a-thon like the previous Wikipedia APA edit-a-thon. In addition to discussing one for Seattle, he wrote:

“ It's awesome to learn about your past in Honolulu - I'm actually going to be there for another SmithsonianAPA project mid September, and thinking that this could be an opportunity to do an event there as well! I have lots of contacts with UH and the museums, but do you know of any contacts on the Wikimedia side out there? ”

As I was working two jobs while I lived on Oahu, I did not have the opportunity to meet your or any other Wikipedians at the time. Hence, the reason why I am contacting you now.

If you would like to help, please contact me through one of these methods:

• Email me directly at peaceray@cascadia.wiki
• Use Special:EmailUser/Peaceray to email me
• Leave a message for me on my talk page.

Mahalo,
Peaceray

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New Challenge for Oceania and Australia

Hi, Wikipedia:WikiProject Oceania/The 10,000 Challenge and Wikipedia:WikiProject Australia/The 5000 Challenge are up and running based on Wikipedia:The 10,000 Challenge which has currently produced over 2300 article improvements and creations. The Australia challenge would feed into the wider region one and potentially New Zealand could have a smaller challenge too. The main goal is content improvement, tackling stale old stubs and important content and improving sourcing/making more consistent but new articles are also welcome if sourced. I understand that this is a big goal for regular editors, especially being summertime where you are, but if you'd like to see large scale quality improvements happening for Oceania and Australia like The Africa Destubathon, which has produced over 1700 articles in 5 weeks, sign up on the page. The idea will be an ongoing national editathon/challenge for the region but fuelled by a series of contests to really get articles on every province and subject mass improved. The Africa contest scaled worldwide would naturally provide great benefits to Oceania countries, particularly Australia and attract new editors. I would like some support from existing editors here to get the Challenges off to a start with some articles to make doing a Destubathon worthwhile and potentially bring about hundreds of improvements in a few weeks through a contest! Cheers.♦ --MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:12, 24 November 2016 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	Hi Joel, I just came across your amazing work on the Kâte language page. I wish more languages of the world had such attentive contributions. Loztron (talk) 13:08, 7 December 2016 (UTC)

Thank you! Most of my work has been on the Austronesian languages around the Huon Gulf, esp. Numbami, Iwal, Yabem, Bukawa. This was my first foray into a Papuan language in that area. Joel (talk) 02:07, 30 December 2016 (UTC)

William Pūnohu White

Aloha, I was wondering do you still reside in the Honolulu area? I am trying to find an image of the gravesite of a woman wither named Emma or Esther Apuna Akina White at the Kaahumanu Society Cemetery [13] in Honolulu. Next to her grave which must be marked is the unmarked grave of her husband William Pūnohu White which I am trying to write a good quality article for. Mahalo.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 22:03, 23 December 2016 (UTC)

It may near the plot where their son Samuel Leialoha White is buried [14].--KAVEBEAR (talk) 22:11, 23 December 2016 (UTC)

Please take your time. There may be an event for him this year on August 6 if it interest you.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 00:53, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

I'll try to find and photograph it, but it may take a while. Joel (talk) 01:57, 30 December 2016 (UTC)

Dog petroglyphs

Aloha Joel, Are you familiar with the dogs and men petroglyphs up in Nuuanu near the Nuuanu Memorial Park around Alekoki pool. I believe it is a hiking trail near there. The first link below shows the coordinates and everything. I believe there are numerous other carvings of primitive depictions of poi dogs along that trail. Do you think you have any time to help me take a few photographs of those petroglyphs?

Here is a list of links of what they should look like. They should all be along the hike.

• http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM2BAF_Hawaiian_man_dog_petroglyphs
• http://users.stlcc.edu/mfuller/nuuanu.html
• http://mikekrzywonski.photoshelter.com/image/I0000StqbG8z1_CQ
• http://mikekrzywonski.photoshelter.com/gallery/Nuuanu-Oahu/G0000SWl1FbaC6z4/C0000tbxNXzFHn_0
• http://hawaiiantimemachine.blogspot.com/2012/07/hawaiian-animal-sounds.html?view=mosaic
• http://www.pacificworlds.com/nuuanu/arrival/images/petro1.jpg

Mahalo, --KAVEBEAR (talk) 01:19, 15 March 2017 (UTC)

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Proposed deletion of China Review International

The article China Review International has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Non-notable journal. Not indexed in any selective databases, no independent sources. Does not meet WP:NJournals or WP:GNG.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Randykitty (talk) 09:26, 14 March 2023 (UTC)

Nomination of China Review International for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article China Review International is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/China Review International until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

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Randykitty (talk) 08:37, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

File permission problem with File:TheContemporaryPacificjournalcover.jpg

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If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Non-free content, use a tag such as {{non-free fair use}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:File copyright tags#Fair use, and add a rationale justifying the file's use on the article or articles where it is included. See Wikipedia:File copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

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File permission problem with File:KoreanStudiescover.gif

Thanks for uploading File:KoreanStudiescover.gif. I noticed that while you provided a valid copyright licensing tag, there is no proof that the creator of the file has agreed to release it under the given license.

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If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Non-free content, use a tag such as {{non-free fair use}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:File copyright tags#Fair use, and add a rationale justifying the file's use on the article or articles where it is included. See Wikipedia:File copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have provided evidence that their copyright owners have agreed to license their works under the tags you supplied, too. Here is a list of your uploads. Files lacking evidence of permission may be deleted one week after they have been tagged, as described in section F11 of the criteria for speedy deletion. You may wish to read Wikipedia's image use policy. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. --Minorax^«¦talk¦» 04:35, 28 April 2023 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Hawaii § Campaign to upload Lāhainā photographs

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Hawaii § Campaign to upload Lāhainā photographs.

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Wikiversity's WikiJournal of the Humanities needs your help!

Hi Joel

I'm the editor-in-chief of the WikiJournal of the Humanities.

Given your experience with Wikipedia and understanding of academia, I'm emailing to ask whether you might be interested in getting involved as an editor for the WikiJournal of Humanities. It's modelled on the successful Wikipedia-integrated journals, the WikiJournal of Medicine, and the WikiJournal of Science. Our editorial board covers a range of fields and expertise, aiming to cover disciplines across the humanities, arts, and social sciences.

Our approach combines the rigour of academic peer review with the extensive reach of an encyclopedia. Consequently, it is an excellent way to achieve public engagement and outreach while impacting public understanding of complex scholarly topics. Articles undergo peer review and are subsequently published in both standard academic PDF format and directly onto Wikipedia, often getting over 100,000 views annually. This enhances the encyclopedia's scientific and factual accuracy and offers academics citable, indexed publications. Moreover, it enables significantly broader dissemination compared to traditional scholarly publishing methods.

The time commitment is flexible. An editor would generally dedicate 2-10 hours per month to a range of activities.

Please let me know if this aligns with your interests, or if you'd like to know more.

Your experience and expertise would be highly appreciated. Fransplace... Let's talk 23:10, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

I would be willing to give it a shot. I've refereed occasional submissions to journals focusing on Pacific-area linguistic and edited lots of articles on PNG languages. But I'm rather tied up at the moment trying to finish up two large publication projects: a grammar of a PNG language that I've worked on for 40+ years, and a survey of NG Coastal languages.

On scrolling thru WikiJournal of the Humanities, I read some of the article on Yolmo, a Tibetan language, and noticed a typo on page 1 under Language Family: "Antonomous" should be "Autonomous" (but the link goes to the correct Wikipedia article). I just finished auditing an introductory course on Classical Tibetan.

Joel Joel (talk) 22:53, 8 May 2024 (UTC)