Talk:Web mapping

Standardize letter case for subject name

Could we have some standard capitalization for "web mapping"? Currently, the article uses a wide mix including this, "Web mapping", "WebMapping", and "Web Mapping", though the last may just occur in section headings, where its capitalization shouldn't be changed from standard, see the Manual of Style.

Yes, I have to be more consistent. I suggest using "web mapping" (small caps, two words), except for headings.

Thanks, Andreasneumann 12:36, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Wikify

Furthermore, this article needs a lot of wikifying. We have articles about many of the concepts, objects and programs mentioned - why not add some wikilinks? I'll do a little, but the author (who obviously knows much more about web mapping than I do) might help. --Huon 17:23, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

{{wikify}}

Regarding links and wiki links, yes I'll add them gradually as time goes. I first want to quickly add some content so others can join and help improve. I have a few colleagues who have knowledge in the domain and will likely contribute.

Thanks, Andreasneumann 12:36, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

May I suggest to Huon that looking up articles that define the jargon terms, program names, etc., is a good way to learn more about the subject of a page. Since I know less about the subject than the primary author of Web mapping, I will add some links as a way to help educate myself on the subject. And I will suggest the same exercise to an interested friend I know. --Teratornis 19:35, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

There is an raw XHTML "object" tag staring the user in the face. Jidanni 10:44, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Talk page refactoring

I like Web mapping; it gives useful information on topics I find interesting. However, I only just now found the page because few other related pages link to it, as mentioned above. I will try to add some links to and from this page. I refactored this talk page slightly, breaking up two discussion topics into separate sections, so we may discuss them separately better. --Teratornis 19:35, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Question about "security issue"

I'm trying to add relevant links to terms in Web mapping for which a defining (or at least substantially relevant) article exists elsewhere in Wikipedia. In some cases Web mapping uses common words in uncommon or specialized ways. Where Web mapping does not define its particular use of a term, the reader would benefit from a link or footnote which does.

The lead section of Web mapping does not define what it means by "security issue" in this sentence:

It also implicates many challenges due to [...] copyright and security issues [...].

Merely linking security to Security sheds no light, because the Security article talks about the general meanings. "Security issue" implies some sort of threat, by one or more people, or some inanimate process, against one or more people, or someone's interests, or some inanimate process or object. The article leaves the reader to guess the identities of all the unstated entities implied by "security issue," which renders the phrase meaningless to any reader who fails to guess what specific security threat the author had in mind. The proximity to "copyright" might suggest that the intellectual property rights of the copyright holder(s) are at risk, but the article does not make that explicit. Other possible interpretations include threats to the security of users of Web maps, or threats to the security of third parties when someone uses map data maliciously. Would someone who knows what the article means by "security issue" give more details about it? If the phrase is a forward reference to something explained later in the article, then let's link the phrase to the relevant section. --Teratornis 03:21, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Interwiki Link

I made a link to the Chinese article on "electronic map service". It was an article I split off from the Chinese article for electronic map awhile back. If this link is deemed inappropriate please discuss and remove accordingly. --Voidvector 06:51, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Mapquest.JPG

Image:Mapquest.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 05:21, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

External links

All of the external links, except the ones that are actually about web mapping, should be removed. The way I see it, the only ones that meet WP:EL are the four at the bottom, on Web Mapping Tutorials and Web Mapping News. The rest are advertising or promotion. Geologyguy 15:31, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:GoogleEarthLogo.JPG

Image:GoogleEarthLogo.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 22:52, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

First Interactive Web Maps

I believe a company called YYMAP.com was the first to offer a "google style" interactive map on the web. Their site served vector data to a custom IE extension that rendered the map in the browser. The company was around as early as the late 90's, but I cann't find any record of it today. Google search turn up resumes for some of the old employees. But I think these guys should get the credit for the first dynamic pan/zoom map that was on-line. even if it was only in IE. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Moclimb (talk • contribs) 00:09, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Types of webmaps

It says: "A first classification of web maps has been made by Kraak" - this isn't true, there were plenty of classification attempts before Kraak (i.e. Fitzke et al. (1997), Rinner (1998)). As it notes, his classification is now very dated. A more current one to re-write that section about may be Plewe's and his dividing them up into generations: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb3006/is_2_34/ai_n29356016/ 193.63.129.209 (talk) 18:18, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Section blanking

The reason for blanking the sections is debatable. I hope we don't have to debate it.

That the article is poorly written is not debatable. It is poorly written. That the article is to be entirely deleted was debated already.

The sections are poorly titled. I don't think they're convenience links or pro-and-con links.

I'm trying to edit the page to improve it, but got only a few seconds to try and do so. Now please, give me a few days? — CpiralCpiral 15:12, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

Having read the sections I firmly believe that the sections shouldn't be there per WP:UNDUE. This is a neutral encyclopedia, and should only be reciting the views of others. It shouldn't be giving advantages and disadvantages. If it was me, I'd reword them in userspace.--Launchballer 15:18, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

It's bad. (I hope you'll like the change effort.) I think it's not NPOV, but WP:RS maybe, WP:NOR maybe. But certainly its wording. There are so many real NPOV and UNDUE, AfD, Wikipedia:Convenience links, and Wikipedia:Pro and con lists issues that you were seeing here (fix started!) on Wikipedia. Please help. — CpiralCpiral 16:02, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

It does not help that the entire section is unsourced. How's it looking now?--Launchballer 16:53, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

Sorry about that edit conflict, as soon as I reintegrate your changes, I'll be back here. I just made a first pass. We'll see, I'm sure. — CpiralCpiral 19:11, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

The edit conflict plus the continued addition of layers of more of your edits is prohibitive. I now must follow your earlier advise, that we work it out off line, right here on the talk page. May I ask that you to stop editing for a minute and talk? — CpiralCpiral 19:42, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

Certainly. You said you was going to reintegrate my changes, which I quickly did. While I was at it, I fixed a load of referencing errors, some already there, some introduced by you.--Launchballer 20:55, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

OK, back to where we had the ec. We both edited the article, and I accepted that. Then I asked if you would wait, I said "I'll be back after I fix the ec". I make the same request now: can I please edit without expectation of any further "integration complexities"? I accept that said work may be reverted, but I respectfully offer include your input. Primarily though, I started first, and your edits were ill timed. I want my original assertions honored, with yours, while I ask for time to do so. May I have a few days, or what do you need? — CpiralCpiral 22:59, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

I wouldn't've thought it would take that long, but I can leave it until the weekend. How does that sound?--Launchballer 23:51, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

It won't take that long. I'm on integration right away til it's done "our way", but then we might to talk further about my choices of your edits. I took out a lot of stuff that I'm sure ruffled our feathers, and I'm not sure yet what you did not take out that I did take out! We'll see shortly. Your response seems generous and understanding. — CpiralCpiral 00:07, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

I have discovered that we ourselves... are golden. For now, just a few cite errors. I got 'em. I applaud your work. Thank you Launchballer. — CpiralCpiral 00:29, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

It's fine, I've fixed the cite errors.--Launchballer 00:34, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

Fine. Then I'll just review that big cleanup tag, and see if we can't have it slimmed to nothing. — CpiralCpiral 00:41, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

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Propose name change/redirect

With the direction of technology, web mapping is becoming a subset of WebGIS, just like computer cartography has become a subset of GIS. Most sources reference WebGIS, not Web Mapping, with a web map being a product of a WebGIS. I have multiple Web/internet GIS textbooks for example, but no Web Mapping, as Web Mapping is a chapter within that broader topic (I can provide sources if necessary). I propose changing Web Mapping to Web Geographic Information Systems to reflect this technology.GeogSage (talk) 20:45, 29 August 2022 (UTC)

- In all respect GeogSage, I would oppose this proposed change. Having 20+ years experience in the geospatial field, I don't see WebGIS as being used that much. WebGIS never had its own entry on Wikipedia, demonstrating to me that the term is not that much common at all. I would also disagree with the statement that a web map is a product of a WebGIS: web maps existed long before WebGIS was a term. Thus yeah, I'd say we'd need multiple solid sources to consider this change? Hope this helps, thanks Lordsatri (talk) 01:06, 30 August 2022 (UTC)

--Thank you for your reply User:Lordsatri! I'm glad to have feedback. I have been writing about WebGIS (others use the term internet GIS) in my professional life and am happy to discuss it (in fact, was hoping for it, I came to this discussion armed with a few sources I was putting together). First, I will say that WebGIS is used extensively in the literature.

So back in the day, we used the term computer cartography more than GIS (see the page Digital mapping. Just added some sources to it from this paragraph). For example the book Analytic and computer cartography by Clark, and Computer-Assisted Cartography by Monmonier. As time progressed, Computer Cartography as a concept blended into GIS in terms of how we approach it, even thought the two are separate concepts (you can do computer cartography in Adobe Photoshop or MS Paint, that does not make them GIS). Likewise, web mapping is a concept that involves creating and using maps on the web. Per the definition on this page "Web mapping or an online mapping is the process of using the maps delivered by geographic information systems (GIS) on the Internet, more specifically in the World Wide Web (WWW). A web map or an online map is both served and consumed, thus web mapping is more than just web cartography, it is a service by which consumers may choose what the map will show." This does highlight the interactive component and is different from conventional mapping.

The next line in the definition on this page emphasizes:

"Web GIS emphasizes geodata processing aspects more involved with design aspects such as data acquisition and server software architecture such as data storage and algorithms, than it does the end-user reports themselves.[2]" This demonstrates that even this Wikipedia page highlights the two as different concepts. Web mapping is done using WebGIS, and although you can technically create a web-map outside of webGIS, that is not often the case. Web Mapping is by and large a product of WebGIS, and WebGIS Extends beyond web mapping as a term and includes distributed data distribution/storage and web analytics.

The 2003 book "Internet GIS" by Zhong-Ren and Meng-Hsiang states "During the writing of this book, we have been pondering its title. Several names have been considered including "Distributed GIS," "Internet GIS and Mobile GIS," "Web GIS," "Network-Based GIServices," and so on." Their justification for calling it internet GIS vs WebGIS is that the Web is a sub-service of the Internet. This may argue for a page change to "Internet GIS", rather then WebGIS as I proposed defined: "as network-based geographic information services that utilize both wired and wireless Internet to access and distribute geographic information, spatial analytical tools, and GIS web services" Further, the book "Mapping in the cloud" describes Web Mapping Services as a subset of internet GIS, as a way to visualize the data that is held within distributed GIS.

While Internet GIS is the broadest term, WebGIS is the subset that many people are more familiar with, and that is used more frequently in literature I've reviewed lately. The books "Web GIS: Principals and Applications" and "Getting to know Web GIS" state that while the Web is a subset of the internet, most GIS is done with the use of the Web.

As the technology progresses, data sharing and data analysis are becoming larger parts of the software, with Web Mapping being our end product. The book Geospatial Semantic Web discusses the importance Web Mapping services as one of five distinct Geospatial Web Services (the other four being Web feature service, web coverage service, web processing service, and catalog service and services-oriented architecture). I have put a suggestion on the Semantic Geospatial Web stub page to move it over here, pending a possible name change.

As you have said, Web or Internet GIS does not have a page on Wikipedia. The lack of a page on Wikipedia does not denote the lack of significance, as several highly significant topics do not have pages (I have made a few pages that, in my opinion, needed to exist). On that note, I did not create an Internet or Web GIS Page because I thought it might be more appropriate to rename the Web Mapping page and expand upon it. If the consensus is that this page should remain Web mapping rather than making web mapping a subheading, I'll create the page for Internet GIS. Most sources would indicate Internet GIS is the higher level. Organization on this topic is a bit of a mess on Wikipedia. I just found a page for the term "CyberGIS" that is hardly in use but has its own page. That should probably be merged in somehow as well. That might be a candidate for renaming if not Web Mapping.

I hope I at least demonstrated that people are talking about and using the term WebGIS here. In my experience, it is used much more frequently than Web Mapping, with a Web Map being a product to be included within a broader Web App and produced and hosted through WebGIS.

GeogSage (talk) 18:23, 30 August 2022 (UTC)

- Thanks User:GeogSage for the details. I few comments: I'm just an experienced geospatial practitionner, I don't claim knowing 'the truth' :-) . Nice example this CyberGIS page on Wikipedia, clearly that page should be merged/moved in my opinion, this is clearly not a term widely used in the industry. To be honest, I still strongly disagree moving the web mapping page to Web GIS. You yourself indicates both are different things. What about the potential path forward: (A) create the WebGIS page, and let's see how it evolves, and (B) later consider merging or moving Web mapping to Web GIS if the Web GIS becomes mature enough and it becomes obvious enough that it makes sense to merge the two. What do you think? Currently, to me it's the inverse, it's obvious that web mapping should not be folded into WebGIS given it's two different things and Web GIS does not even have a page! That's rather expected given while Web GIS is slowly getting adopted, in practice it's nowhere as ubiquitous as web mapping at the moment. Hope this is useful and suits you, cheers! Lordsatri (talk) 20:49, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply.

I'm just a lowly grad student. All I know about GIS is that I really have only started learning anything, and what I do know is probably wrong.

You are right they are different things, and probably worthy of different pages. After writing the novel above yesterday, I began work on trying to high order organize pages by creating a few new ones with information from it.

My idea is to create a page for Internet Geographic Information Systems with a huge emphasis on WebGIS. This talk gives confirmation that a new one is probably more appropriate then merging existing. I don't think that we need pages for both internet GIS and WebGIS, so I'll try to keep WebGIS as a section within the page. My understanding of the hierarchy in the literature is Internet GIS>WebGIS>Web Mapping With a parallel example being GIS>Digital cartography. I think some parts of this page might be suited to move to a Internet GIS page as a WebGIS section, and elaboration on Web Mapping capabilities. CyberGIS probably needs to be merged once that happens, as well as the Geospatial Semantic Web stub page. GeogSage (talk) 23:11, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

On this topic, I have created the page Internet GIS. It needs some expansion.

My understanding is that the GIS tree goes GIS> Distributed GIS> Internet GIS> WebGIS> WebMapping and other services. Wikipedia was missing Internet GIS, and is still missing WebGIS. I think WebGIS warrants its own page as well. GeogSage (talk) 07:31, 14 September 2022 (UTC)

References

Moving Content between pages.

Hello everyone. Previously I had discussed a page name change, and was rightfully told that Web mapping is enough of its own topic that new pages should be created for the other topics. On this line, I have been working to create a few pages and organize categories related to using computers to handle spatial data.

My understanding is that there are two categories Web Mapping falls under.

The first is Geographic information systems>Distributed GIS>Internet GIS>Web GIS>Web mapping

The second is Cartography>Digital mapping>Web mapping.

There is a lot of overlap between these topics but they are all distinct, large, terms used in the literature. There is a lot on this page that I think could be moved to both the Internet GIS and Web GIS pages, especially around the historical timeline. It seems Web mapping has been the default page for most of the Web and internet GIS content. Creating this discussion so we can talk about reorganization. GeogSage (talk) 17:22, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Technology and Culture

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 21 August 2023 and 15 December 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Amckune (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Anieukir.

— Assignment last updated by Thecanyon (talk) 05:32, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Hello @Anieukir and @Amckune! This article needs a lot of work in my opinion and I welcome assistance. If you need citations, there are links above to some of the other GIS based pages. In December 2022, I laid out some of my ideas for how this page could fit in with the others relevant pages on Wikipedia(Geographic information systems, Distributed GIS, Internet GIS, Web GIS, Web Map Service, Cartography, and Computer cartography to name a few). There are a lot of good Web GIS and Web Mapping related content there if you would like to take a look. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 18:25, 27 November 2023 (UTC)