Talk:Eight Worlds

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Consistency

okay so a lot of the details in these stories don't quite match up, especially with steel beach and golden globe. this makes it hard for the article to get any particular accuracy without "well except for..."s after every mention. i just added a few of those myself, but i tried to keep them unannoying. i added that last section on consistency, with varley's author note, and a couple references to it in the article. is there a better way to do this? steel beach is the only story i have read recently, so i don't really remember what happened to who when, for the most part. --dan 07:17, 24 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Which worlds?

Shouldn't the article mention which planets and moons are the "Eight Worlds"? DenisMoskowitz (talk) 20:55, 23 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think the Eight Worlds are: Mercury, Venus, Luna (moon of Earth), Mars, Titan (moon of Saturn), one of the moons of Uranus, Triton (moon of Neptune), and Pluto. I'm not putting this into the main article because I don't have a specific cite of where they are listed, and I am not sure if they list the outer gas giants by the planet, or the inhabited moon, or the rings in the case of Saturn. Cptbutton (talk) 11:59, 13 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

In the Reader JV mentions that he has not yet written a short story set on each. Maybe it is still open-ended even to him! 2A01:CB0C:CD:D800:5427:E980:45FE:B960 (talk) 20:41, 20 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Vermin?

The article currently contains this sentence concerning the Invaders: "They classify living beings in one of three categories: those such as themselves, who arise in gas giant planets everywhere, cetaceans such as dolphins and whales, and vermin, the last category including all sentient beings other than Invaders and cetaceans". Is there a source for this "vermin" part? My recollection is that, after animals like themselves, the Invaders most value sentient animals which also operate in a fully three-dimensional domain, hence cetaceans on Earth, and only "punished" humans because they threatened these. And this punishment was "only" the removal of technology on the Earth - the Invaders don't kill any humans directly, and left human settlements away from the Earth completely untouched. Furthermore, when it becomes clear to the Invaders that humans can't be trusted to abide with this situation, they gift humanity with the singularity technology to allow them to leave our solar system and settle other systems. That doesn't sound quite like "vermin" to me - is this perhaps simply the viewpoint of one particular character in the Eight Worlds? Cheers, --PLUMBAGO 08:16, 24 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

This is a valid point, but I am not sure how to rewrite the main article. In "The Ophiuchi Hotline" there are two relevant passages. The word "vermin" does not appear in this context.

From the only human to have direct contact with the Invaders: "Bronson said there are levels of intelligence in the universe. On top are the Jovians and Invaders. One step below are the dolphins and whales. Humans, birds, bees, beavers, ants, and corals are not considered intelligent." (Chapter 6)

From the Traders, an interstellar society roughly similar to humanity in origin: "Tool-using species, those which evolve on land and in an atmosphere which permits combustion, are the third level of intelligence. We share this level with you, but it should be pointed out that there can be levels within levels." (Chapter 22)

As you note, the Invaders do show some very limited concern for the survival of third-level intelligences.

Also I don't think the concept of "operate in a fully three-dimensional domain" appears in the book explicitly. Cptbutton (talk) 13:16, 13 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Singularity based drive not described as "faster than light."

I changed the characterization of the singularity based drive as "faster than light" because it is not described as such in the text of "The Ophiuchi Hotline":

"The basis for a space drive. When you learn to use it, which will be very soon, you will be able to reach high speeds very quickly, and with very little fuel. The stars will be in your reach."

I think this means it makes near-lightspeed travel easier rather than FTL. Elsewhere in the book it is noted that interstellar travel is already feasible for humans using the black hole and nullfield technology they already have.Cptbutton (talk) 12:52, 13 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]