Talk:List of Indian football champions

Total titles won

Hi, SAIKAT MARINERS DEY! I have to discuss some things with you regarding some edits you've done to List of Indian football champions.

1. I've noticed you've undid my edit in List of Indian football champions total titles won section, by changing the rank from 8 to 9. I don't understand why would you do that. In your edit, there is no 8th ranked team, i.e. after 7 it's 9! So please resond, or I'll again change it!
2. In the same section(i.e. total titles won), you've marked ATK as a defunct club. Using the logic by which you've done this, Mohun Bagan should also be marked as a non-competing club, as there is no existence of the football division of Mohun Bagan club as of today(8 March 2021), and so, it cannot compete in any football competition. However, there exists a new merged club ATK Mohun Bagan, which is and will be competing in different football competitions from the season 2020-2021.
   

Laser Victor 2017 ❯❯❯ talk 16:09, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

1. In 7th ranked there are two teams so I have skipped one number 2. Actually in Wikipedia of Mohun Bagan it is written that Football operations of Mohun Bagan are now known as ATK MOHUN BAGAN FC. Moreover in all Wikipedia pages related to comparison between East Bengal and Mohun Bagan there are written as Mohun Bagan/ATK Mohun Bagan. So I have made this edit. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 16:34, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

1. The 7th position is jointly held by the 2 teams, so both have rank 7, no need to skip one number!
2. Yes, correctly said! Indeed, the "Football operations of Mohun Bagan are now known as ATK MOHUN BAGAN FC." So, there is no club named Mohun Bagan playing currently in any competition. Instead, the new club named ATK Mohun Bagan FC is competing in this year's ISL and will compete in other eligible competitions. You may check the club's wikipedia page or its talk page, especially this section for clarification. As for the comparison, I don't know which page(s) you are talking about, but if anything you believe is wrong please edit it, or preferably start a discussion on the respective talk page(s).

• I'm changing the position number now (9 --> 8), but please make sure of marking Mohun Bagan as a non-participating club(as, if ATK Mohun Bagan wins or loses this year's ISL play-offs, it will be written only against ATK Mohun Bagan FC, neither ATK, nor Mohun Bagan) as I'm not getting much time to edit nowadays!😅 Laser Victor 2017 ❯❯❯ talk 18:43, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Subsection

ArsenalFan700, shall we name the subsection as Parallel leagues rather than I-League and ISL ??? Drat8sub (talk) 21:13, 6 June 2020 (UTC)

Drat8sub, Nah, I think when taking into account champions pages at places like England, US and Canada, and Germany, it would be the right thing to have it named I-League and Indian Super League (2017–present) with then two sub-headers for I-League and Indian Super League. See the draft page for what I mean. Thoughts? --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 21:25, 6 June 2020 (UTC)

Yup, looks better with years. Drat8sub (talk) 21:30, 6 June 2020 (UTC)

ArsenalFan700, you have completed the NFL and I-League table with highest goal scorer, are you going to add something else, if not please add the same in the article. And SaikatMarinerDey changed the ISL titles numbers which I think ok, as the note is further giving the required information. Drat8sub (talk) 14:09, 7 June 2020 (UTC)

I'll add them when I get a chance. I am too much of a perfectionist haha. Also, Saikat needs to calm down. --ArsenalFan700 (talk) 15:46, 7 June 2020 (UTC)

SAIKAT MARINERS DEY, discuss here. Don't comment everytime at my talk page. Other editors need to see all discussions going on related to this article. Drat8sub (talk) 14:45, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

According to AIFF road map isl is india's top league so Isl champions are Indian champions . So please i-league champions from total wins and champions list Sinan 2004 (talk) 03:37, 21 June 2020 (UTC)

First of all AFC gives license to clubs to play in continental level, so what AIFF says or not says it does not matter. However, in this case, they says what AFC says, and AFC surely consider ISL as a top league but did not say that I-League is second league and along with that per the road map, the parallel league will exist and by 2024 the relegation-promotion starts, then only we can call it only top league. Until then both league champions participating in the continental level and will be considered top league. The road map here is clear ISL attained premier status in 2019-20, ISL gets AFC Champions League play-off which later on get into group stage due to increase in number of teams for incorporating developing footballing nations, 2020-21 will allow two clubs to join ISL leaving I-league, in this case most probably EB & another club and 2022-23 will see promotion of I-League winner of previous season means of 2021-22 to 2022-23 ISL without fee but no relegation at this point and this will continue to 2023-24. And in 2024-25 fully promotion-relegation will start, so 2024 will be the year when we can say that without any doubt that ISL is only top league. Hope its clear and don't ask again same thing in every ISL related articles. Drat8sub (talk) 04:37, 21 June 2020 (UTC)

Sinan 2004 repeatedly vandalises this page. Please correct this page and warn Sinan 2004. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 15:35, 4 March 2021 (UTC)

1st tier in Indian Football

Hi Rufyrosh, in the History section of the article, it is written: "Since its inception in the 1996–97 season, the champions of the NFL were considered as the national champions," which is also endorsed by different citations. Also, in every other place in the article, it has been mentioned as only National Football League, not with the Premier Division.
And, to your reference to the English Football Champions, there are 2 completely separate articles for Football league and Football league First Division, which we don't have in case of National Football League.
SAIKAT MARINERS DEY, ArsenalFan700, Drat8sub any comments? Laser Victor 2017 ❯❯❯ talk 19:02, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

Reverting the said edit, as no further arguments are made till now. Laser Victor 2017 ❯❯❯ talk 11:38, 26 April 2021 (UTC)

Vandalism

@Lancepark, you are vandilsing this page. Understand the difference between premiers and champions. In Australia, the regular season table toppers i.e, premiers are given highest AFC slot. Now A league champions are grabbed AFC slot. But still in championship count, only champions are included in the champions list, not premiers. You can see List of Australian soccer champions. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 01:30, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

Who is the champions of ISL?

A big confusion is created after announcing of the champions badge to be worn by League Shield winners not by ISL Trophy winners. So many editors started to include ISL league shield winners into championship title since 2022-23 season. What can be done? @Drat8subsir! SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 14:56, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

@Lancepark you will see discussion here. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 14:57, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

No confusion at all, if they say the regular league winner is the champion, we will keep them as champion, if they say knockout winners as champions we will keep them as champion, as simle as that, we no need to interpret anything otherwise. An we will only keep records or change only if such announced by ISL, not before that. For now ATK-MohunBagan is the ISL champion. Drat8sub (talk) 15:57, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

@Drat8sub, thank you so much to prevent vandalism. Vandalism has started also in Mohun Bagan AC and Indian Super League pages also. Please solve those page SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 00:50, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

This is not vandalism. The edits should be taken in good faith. Rest I have explained above. Drat8sub (talk) 07:20, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

@Drat8sub, Thanks for the clarification. Lancepark (talk) 09:28, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

@Drat8sub again champions and total title section are vandalised. Please come. Repeatedly same vandalism occurs. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 12:32, 7 January 2024 (UTC)

@Drat8sub again Wiki pages are confused and vandalised. If Mohun Bagan is considered as this season champions then Mumbai City should be considered as 2022/23 season champions as they wear the champions badge which affect the previous season. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 03:26, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

@SAIKAT MARINERS DEY As per these reports, 2023-24 report 1 and 2023-24 report 2, FSDL on ISL's own website seems to be using the term 'ISL Champions' for league winners shield from this season. Now we can wait for it till the end of the playoffs, and see what term they would be using for playoffs/Cup winners.
Meanwhile, we can continue with these suggestions if possible.
For 2022-23 season: ISL champion and national title champions of 2022–23 remain ATK Mohun Bagan. These ISL reports such as, 2022-23 cup report mention playoff cup winners as being the ISL champions (which was the norm), while Mumbai City were not termed as league winners in the 2022-23 shield report.
But for 2023-24 season, we may tentatively use national title champions of 2023–24 for League Winner's Shield (Premiers) i.e. Mohun Bagan SG until the playoff final. There already is too much confusion over these terms, but its likely that national league title might be marked with Premiers instead the Champions from 2023-24 season in the infobox. Lancepark (talk) 20:33, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

@Lancepark After July 2023 taking decision of giving the champions badge to the previous season league shield winners, FSDL never mentioned Mohun Bagan sg as the 2022/23 ISL champions. Everywhere in each and every report they're saying that Mohun Bagan was 2022/23 ISL Cup winners not champions. For this reason they are promoting league shield winners. During last season ISL this decision was not taken so they were using normal terms. If you see the reports then you will see that during whole season FSDL mentioned Mohun Bagan sg just as Defending ISL Cup winners not ISL champions. For this after winning the league shield FSDL never mentioned Mohun Bagan as second time ISL champions. So if this season Mohun Bagan is champions then previous season Mumbai City is champions. So we've to wait upto Cup final. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 03:02, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

@SAIKAT MARINERS DEY Yeah went through the reports, FSDL stopped mentioning Mohun bagan SG as ISL champion post 23 July 2023, same time range when champions badge was given to Mumbai City, I guess this concludes the retrospective change of FSDL's stance towards League shield winners. Lets wait until the end of playoffs and see if there are any further changes there. Lancepark (talk) 21:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

@Lancepark I think it's just the indication of in future The playoffs can be annuled as that has no AFC value further. Original ISL champions may be only ISL cup winners. I'm saying this because if you notice the back counting on giant screen before an ISL match then only knockout winner are displayed including season 9 winners ATK Mohun Bagan. Actually who is the main champions is totally confused by FSDL themselves. They're sending hot and cold water through same pipeline. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 07:47, 19 April 2024 (UTC)

@SAIKAT MARINERS DEY Right, that has been the case with so much confusion and inability of FSDL to settle on a specific terminology and instead oscillating between these norms depending on season to season. ISL playoffs losing the AFC spot is a likely cause of these issues. I think in time a few changes has to be made with respect to infobox as well, something along the lines of MLS which uses a more customised Shield and Cup parameters, instead of A-League which uses Champions (for playoffs) and Premiers (regular season). For ISL, the A-League format worked fine until 2021-22 season, but with League Winners Shield getting the 'Champions' status from 2022-23, denoting ISL cup winners as champions in the infobox don't seem quite correct and is more confusing (like the infobox of 2022–23 Indian Super League).

Champions vandalism

@Sinan 2004 come here. In this page also started to be vandalised. Mohun Bagan are called as 7 time champions by double meaning. I alone can't fight. @Drat8sub you also come please. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 03:41, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

@Sinan 2004 you're saying ISL league toppers as champions from 2022/23 so why you have written Mohun Bagan as seven times champions. SAIKAT MARINERS DEY (talk) 04:06, 17 April 2024 (UTC)