Wikipedia : In the news/Candidates/April 2018

This won't be posted with 2 of the 3 references in Chinese, and the 3rd a Google book search. Step hen 23:26, 12 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Is there a new rule against non-English references? And what's the problem with Google books? Books published by academic presses are considered the gold standard of reliable sources, far more so than news articles. -Zanhe (talk) 00:32, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

WP:NONENG: Template:Tq And the book source is a perfectly formatted reference, it is good to include a google books link where possible. The referencing here is fully adequate for posting. —LukeSurl^{t c} 08:21, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

And the apparent consensus here not to post articles created posthumously. – Muboshgu (talk) 23:32, 12 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

This is the first time I've heard of this "consensus". Could you point me to the relevant discussion? -Zanhe (talk) 00:32, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Some people have raised this objection on occasion but it has absolutely not reached “consensus”. It is clear that this individual is notable and any editor who things otherwise should go to AfD rather than object here. —LukeSurl^{t c} 08:24, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I said "apparent consensus". I created Tyler Hilinski posthumously and it was opposed here (though still never nominated for deletion). Another athlete got a posthumous article rejected here, and was either kept or no consensus at AfD. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:40, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support and people wonder why Wikipedia still has a systemic bias problem. The sources are fine; the article is looking good and should be posted. As for the concept article creation time is relevant, the template itself says anybody with an article is notable. -- BobTheIP editing as 2.28.13.227 (talk) 02:01, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support A well-referenced article on a recently deceased person. The technical objections raised above do not aid the encyclopaedia and are not even valid technicalies as they have no basis in policy. —LukeSurl^{t c} 08:28, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Close as stale. This now predates the oldest entry on the RD ticker.--WaltCip (talk) 11:14, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Not yet, John Lambie (the nomination below) is still on the main page. -Zanhe (talk) 14:34, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support Since there are now more than three sources. You people were wrong to object to Tyler Hilinski, and it would be wrong to object to this. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:41, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support foreign language citation are acceptable.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 17:11, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted, though acknowledging it won't stay long. Courcelles (talk) 23:49, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for all the support, interesting how many strange reasons of objection this nomination has received. -Zanhe (talk) 23:51, 13 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] RD: John Lambie

Support Referencing appears fine. Looks good enough.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:08, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - looks fine. -Zanhe (talk) 19:04, 12 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted. Black Kite (talk) 19:13, 12 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] Facebook–Cambridge Analytica data scandal

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2018 April 9 Template:Cob

Oppose It's just testimony, though. There's no legislation likely to come out of the U.S. Congress, and as far as I'm aware nothing major came out of this hearing. The "data scandal" article is also pretty rough. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:30, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose This is literally all over the news (it hits the perfect combo of high tech celebrity, social media, and politics), but it's just testimony. From what I've read, there's nothing that seals the deal on the Russian interference (if it did or did not happen), and no other major revelations came out of this. It's a lot of noise that has very little end results at this point. --Masem (t) 22:32, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. As Masem wrote, this is celebrity drama with zero long-term significance yet. Facebook had similar controversies before and nothing illegal had been done in those controversies so they died down. Speaking of Russian interference, there are far more notable events that happened but were not promoted at ITN. wumbolo ^^^ 22:58, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose There is nothing remarkable about this yet. Maybe there will be later, but we can reconsider if it comes to that. Natureium (talk) 23:13, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Orange tagged article. It's dominating the news, and would be a welcome break from our usual fare of cricket scandals and soccer scores. --LaserLegs (talk) 23:59, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - A remarkable nothingburger of a non-story.--WaltCip (talk) 01:07, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Abottom

April 9

[Posted] RD: Felix Chen

Comment. Very short. There's a quotation in the lead 'he resigned in 2003 under "extremely controversial circumstances."' which isn't cited there or elsewhere. In view of the BLP concerns I'd like to see more referencing on this issue. Espresso Addict (talk) 02:55, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Template:Ping: Article has been expanded with info of his firing and controversy along with lead expansion. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 05:48, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, the article is still far from the quality I'd be prepared to support. Espresso Addict (talk) 13:05, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support, The article now looks fairly OK. –Ammarpad (talk) 08:47, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Meets RD standards.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 13:37, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support article seems ready now -- BobTheIP editing as 2.28.13.227 (talk) 17:17, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted. 331dot (talk) 17:27, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] Russia threatens nuclear attack against Western targets over possible intervention in Syria

Oppose Bloviators gonna bloviate. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:39, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose based purely on "last month". If they repeat the warning now, I will likely support. power~enwiki (π, ν) 22:49, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Complete non-starter. The proposed blurb bears no relation to any content in either article mentioned, and the Douma attack is already being discussed in a separate nomination below. This should be closed. Pawnkingthree (talk) 23:01, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose too soon. If the threat keeps up and draws more media attention, then we can consider this. Analogously, the Cuban Missile Crisis would've been worth posting if ITN existed back then, and we should not wait until one side fired missiles; however that episode also stayed in mainstream news for a long time. Banedon (talk) 23:08, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

There’s a vague mention of “grave repercussions” – that hardly equates to “threatens nuclear attack against Western targets.” Pawnkingthree (talk) 23:23, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, hence this nomination is too soon. Banedon (talk) 23:28, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Abottom

[Posted] 2018 Masters Tournament

Weak support The lead is a bit light on text, per WP:LEAD, however there is a prose summary of each round, which is well referenced. Meets minimum standards. --Jayron 32 13:40, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support -The article is overall sufficient and referenced. –Ammarpad (talk) 17:05, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - ITN/R. We are good to go with this one. Stormy clouds (talk) 17:10, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posting. --Tone 19:54, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] Senator Tammy Duckworth

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Oppose see DYK. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:09, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - well for her, and congratulations, but this is not a story of lasting international significance, and is not worthy of ITN in my view. Stormy clouds (talk) 20:13, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Two men oppose the nom, so it's a snow close. Good for them, & congratulations. -- llywrch (talk) 21:59, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Abottom

April 8

[Posted] RD: Michael Goolaerts

Support I ref'd everything in the body of the article needing a source. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 09:48, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support -Looks OK. –Ammarpad (talk) 12:08, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
SupportIt was in a sorry state before, but now looks like it can be added. Good work! -- BobTheIP editing as 88.111.223.24 (talk) 13:21, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posting. --Tone 13:34, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] Hungarian parliamentary election, 2018

Comment will election results come in in the next few days? If so, wait until the result, which will certainly be worthy. -- BobTheIP editing as 2.28.13.227 (talk) 18:12, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. This is ITNR, but we only post the results, not the mere occurrence of the election. 331dot (talk) 19:12, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The results will probably come in within hours (the election was supposed to end at 7 pm, but some people have been standing in line for hours and are still waiting to get in, due to the usual bureaucratic SNAFU our election office is well known for...) – Alensha ^talk 20:20, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment – AP cites preliminary returns to say Orban "easily won a third consecutive term." Sca (talk) 22:32, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. There's really no point in us all going round on this until someone updates the article. Then we need a sourced paragraph on reactions, which is what sinks most of these ITN-R election articles. Espresso Addict (talk) 22:38, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support: I added an alternative blurb, since we now know the results and the article has been updated. This is definitely newsworthy enough to add. --1990'sguy (talk) 23:46, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment – Getting old fast. Sca (talk) 00:17, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

That's why we need to add it fast. --1990'sguy (talk) 00:18, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support the target article isn't perfect, but it's good enough. power~enwiki (π, ν) 00:20, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support: Article looks good, and this is a newsworthy election. Raymond3023 (talk) 03:30, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. I'd like to see some mention of the electoral conduct; for example The Guardian is quoting the Organisation for Security and Cooperation in Europe criticising the electoral conduct.[33] Espresso Addict (talk) 03:27, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted a modified blurb, substituting "a coalition" for "Fidesz". The article makes it clear that it was an alliance of Fidesz and the KDNP which won the election, and I am not comfortable highlighting only one of those parties, even if it is the major partner in the coalition. If folks wish to change this, further discussion is welcome, here or at WP:ERRORS. Vanamonde (talk) 06:01, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] Douma chemical attack

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Wait - there's fairly little detail about the attack itself (where exactly, with what, when, etc.) and this might have to wait. Once fixed Strong support - even by Syrian Civil War standards this is highly abnormal. Juxlos (talk) 16:41, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose as it stands. This is never going to fly folks, every genuine reliable source is adding "alleged" or "purported" or "apparent" as a caveat to the event itself. What might swing it is simply that at least 70 people were killed (although I heard on the radio [BBC] that this was a very low estimate) in this attack. It's indisputably in the news, and indisputably a significant act, we just need to get the blurb right without wandering into POV or speculation. Article is sufficient in any case. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:05, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support in principle. "Alleged" or "apparent" or even "suspected" can easily be added to the blurb. Can we be less precise about the number of deaths? BBC is hedging on 70 vs 48 by calling it "dozens". Espresso Addict (talk) 21:36, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Well that's where you're plain wrong. If we add "alleged" or "apparent" or "suspected", no-one will support this nomination. That's very much how ITN works. With all the experience I have here, I should know...... The Rambling Man (talk) 21:39, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Just because absurd decisions have been made in the past... I'd support with that sort of wording if the article can be got into posting quality. We make ITN a laughing stock when we apparently ignore important encyclopedic news in favour of posting sports/election results & transport accidents. Espresso Addict (talk) 21:50, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

No, it's not really about "absurd" decisions, it's really about the uncertainty and then the liability. We don't tend to post "it may be this" kind of stories, and we certainly wouldn't post this as a de facto "chemical attack", so all we have now to get this onto the main page is an single attack which has killed dozens in Syria. And that's considered "plus ca change". The Rambling Man (talk) 21:53, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think User:The Rambling Man continues to make excellent arguments. I would argue that the evidence is overwhelming that "A chemical weapons attack in Douma, Syria kills at least 70 people." is unquestionably true. However, there may also be good reasons not to post this particular blurb. For example, a pacifist may want to avoid drawing attention to an event that may lead the United States into world war 3. Brian Everlasting (talk) 23:37, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think the president of that country might have noticed already. Espresso Addict (talk) 23:53, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose minus "background" and "reactions" it's a stub. Personally I'm tired of the phrase "anti government activists" in the Syrian civil war articles. --LaserLegs (talk) 23:45, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Weak support: Al Jazeera did not used the "alleged" tone when discussing the incident and some other more recent articles have followed suit, though older stories are still more popular in searches. As further news breaks, some wording may change. United Nations emergency meeting is to be held regarding the situation.----ZiaLater (talk) 00:24, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support in principle It's not a stub. The article has 2500 characters of prose, which is a start class. It'll be expanded and it's minimally long enough now. The "background" section does and should count to the total, since obviously the background matters to why a chemical attack would happen here. The "reactions" are bulleted so they don't count to the character count. Obviously that POV tag needs to be dealt with first. – Muboshgu (talk) 02:41, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose as this is part of a larger event that is already listed as ongoing. or rather, we could just remove the other if we choose to post this. GCG (talk) 11:45, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose on quality. If you take out the BG and the reactions section, there's hardly anything about the actual "event" (attack or whatever it will be considered). I agree the BG section is needed, but it should not dominate, and reaction sections like the one here are highly discouraged, it should not be a quotefarm but actual reactions, such as medical or military aid being offered, etc. As such, it is far too stubby to post. --Masem (t) 14:00, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support this is seeing more than enough coverage to warrant posting, especially given the threats of escalation. Banedon (talk) 23:13, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

With UN resolutions being discussed and a veto being used, I think this is at a point where it should be posted quickly. Banedon (talk) 23:43, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comment – As the facts remain contested, along with the death toll, this might be better posted under 'ungoing' IMO. Sca (talk) 00:22, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support in principle Donald Trump announced he would skip the eighth Summit of the Americas to oversee the United States response to the attack, so I also support the possibility of posting as 'ongoing'. If it helps with NPOV, I suggest using the White Helmets' estimate and changing the blurb to at least 43 people. --Jamez42 (talk) 14:49, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per Masem. It is a significant event, but the article is not good enough. --Pawnkingthree (talk) 15:01, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per The Rambling Man and Masem. --Mhhossein ^talk 18:31, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support per Muboshgu and Banedon. Jusdafax (talk) 00:27, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Though the article is weak, this is the news story of the week 155.225.2.100 (talk) 02:11, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - In the news for the past couple of days. Sherenk1 (talk) 04:48, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - per political significance. Article is in good enough shape for posting.BabbaQ (talk) 07:32, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
As this is now trending toward posting, can I ask again if it is appropriate to post a sub-event of an item already posted as ongoing? GCG (talk) 16:03, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The posting admin should probably remove the ongoing when the blurb is posted, until it ages off, when the ongoing can be restored. Espresso Addict (talk) 20:31, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I've left it up as I think there's value in keeping the wider article there, but I don't feel strongly about it. Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 23:35, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support per Banedon, still in the news, thus it's very notable. Davey2116 (talk) 21:19, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Admin Comment Removed Attention Needed- there is no discernible consensus to post. -Ad Orientem (talk) 23:28, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted - Per what I see as a rough consensus, though I didn't see Ad's comment beforehand. Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 23:32, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

April 7

[Posted] Bundesliga

Oppose What archive are you looking at? It was nominated, but not posted last year. I think that was the only time it was even nominated. It has been mentioned in a few football nomination threads, but mostly dismissively – Muboshgu (talk) 02:55, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- To be clear, I am opposing because this is a lower tiered league than the Premier League, soccer is already sufficiently represented at ITN/R, such as with the Champions League, as mentioned by GCG, and the article isn't that great. It's one short section of prose followed by a ton of tables. One specific issue is "clean sheets". The term is used once, in a section header, and never defined. Not everyone knows what one of those is. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:23, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - It's not "lower tiered league"; it's the top league in Germany just as the EPL is the top league in England. It may not have as high a profile or as many TV viewers worldwide, but that's a different thing. And it should be fairly trivial to wikilink Shutout#Association football somewhere.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 16:57, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
    - American football and baseball have no such terms, everything from safety to RBI is clearly obvious. The Rambling Man (talk) 17:04, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
      - Whenever I write about RBIs, I link to run batted in to provide the necessary context to our readers. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:08, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        Indeed, so you actually already know that this "specific reason" is really nothing to even be noted here, and something that the addition of, what, 14 extra bytes would solve in a jiffy? The Rambling Man (talk) 19:24, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        It is a bit ironic to see someone who argued for the inclusion of the NCAA football national champion on grounds like cultural significance dismiss this so easily. This is a top tier domestic league. Bayern is among the best club teams on earth(really hate to say that, cannot stand them lol), unlike the NCAA national champion which is worlds apart from the top of the game. The german league is among the strongest in europe, probably world wide, as well. It is culturally significant, it is domestic top tier, has high attendance, the winner of the league is among the best teams on earth and the quality of the league is easily in the top 5 world wide i would say, probably top 3 even. So if you oppose this Muboshgu, will you oppose next years college football final as well? 91.248.254.186 (talk) 21:43, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support. Article appears to be reasonably well referenced and the Bundesliga is a significant competition. It has the highest average attendance of any league in the world and UEFA rates it as the second best in Europe based on Champions League performance. Capitalistroadster (talk) 05:39, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support. Domestic football is a big deal. The point at which a league is sufficiently notable for ITN posting is arbitrary, but for me La Liga, the English Premiership and the Bundesliga (in that order) are the three that are above that line. 2017–18_Bundesliga#Summary appears to be adequate prose in the article. --LukeSurl^{t c} 14:31, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose My concern isn't that this is a domestic league; it's that the Champions League, which is the premier event for these clubs, is ITNR already. GCG (talk) 15:47, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support I'm just seeing "I don't like it", the Bundesliga is probably in the top three football leagues in the world, and football has a global audience of billions, so this will be of interest to a vast number of our readers across the continents of our planet. Probably more so than college basketball I would guess....... The Rambling Man (talk) 16:16, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- I expanded on my opposition. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:23, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Question is this the "top of the sport"? I thought the UEFA Champions League was that -- if that's the case, this is a simple qualifier. --LaserLegs (talk) 16:59, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Why does it need to be "top of the sport" to feature as a normal ITN? Is "top of the sport" a new ITN criterion I've missed?? I've never heard anything so preposterous in my highly experienced life. The Rambling Man (talk) 17:03, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The Champions League is, despite its name, actually a knock-out competition, not directly comparable to individual countries' leagues.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 17:06, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
So the "top tier" of European football is the UEFA? Or are those just demonstration games? Im honestly trying to understand -- because I don't know. --LaserLegs (talk) 17:13, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Teams compete in domestic leagues, such as the Premier League in England, or the Bundesliga in Germany. These events are organised on a domestic scale, not by UEFA. Then, based on how well they performed in the preceding season, teams enter the UEFA Champions League, where they play against other European clubs initially in a league, and subsequently (i.e. now) in knockout football. However, clubs spend the vast majority of their time playing in the domestic league - 38 games as opposed to about a dozen in the Champions League, so they should not be ignored. Winning the domestic league is a big deal, however, suffice it to say, and warrants attention at ITN. Stormy clouds (talk) 17:24, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

So there are 55 member countries in the UEFA .. subject to article quality are all of their championships a big deal suitable for posting to ITN? --LaserLegs (talk) 17:52, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Obviously not. It is our job to determine which ones do, and I would not consider the answer to be "one of them". Stormy clouds (talk) 18:07, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support - prominent European league, of significant interest to our readership. Stormy clouds (talk) 17:24, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose With association football being as big as it is, we purposes have whats at ITNR to limit how many stories in this area that would come up at ITNR. As there are more significant tourneys in that region that include Germany, we should focus on that, rather than the nationals. --Masem (t) 17:31, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
This is one of the stranger arguments I've seen here. We don't limit our number of American gun crime stories, the consensus to post or otherwise makes that self-limiting. We don't have ITNR to limit stories, we have it to accept stories which have been endlessly debated. That we post the Premier League knocks this other "significant tourneys" debate into the long grass. According to that, we'd only ever post the winner of the Champions League, which we don't. And since football truly global and watched by literally billions, I think we're all able to accept that a few extra stories about it here will do Wikipedia no harm at all. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:57, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
False. Stories about gun violence in America are routinely opposed as being routine. --LaserLegs (talk) 19:47, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
What? "the consensus to post or otherwise makes that self-limiting." completely 100% true. How odd. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:07, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Agree. Nothing odd about it. --LaserLegs (talk) 20:24, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Ec There is a difference between what we can plan and what we can't. We're not going to cap, say, hurricane disasters if there's 10 that strike and made deadly landfall, but we're still discrimating towards hurricanes with minimal damage or impact and certainly not posting every hurricane that forms. But when we have events we can plan on, one of the considerations at ITNR is how many stories in that topic area are generated per year. We try to avoid over-saturation where we can in any one specific topic area, and in a case where we have a tiered sport like these European leagues, we have to make a concerted effort of drawing a line to avoid excessive coverage of incremental elements. And while I do see the ITNR suggests only adding three specific national events in addition to the Premiere League on the bases those four have assured slots, I still think it becomes a bias issue if we're not including the other 30-some national results, but at the same time ITN can't handle those 30-some blurbs. --Masem (t) 19:49, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Who said 30-some? I think the absolute most ever proposed was three or four? Wild extrapolation doesn't help anything. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:07, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Template:U. It's not bias to only choose the leagues which are ranked the highest, and have other visible advantages over the others (attendance, TV audience, global column inches, commercial investments). I don't think any Welshman, Irishman, Gibraltarian, Andorran, Sammarinese, Luxembourger etc would legitimately question Wikipedia neutrality if their national league was excluded. Harambe Walks (talk) 20:38, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - please see ITN/R proposal, so that we can solve the significance argument now and put the perennial debate to bed for a while. Thanks, Stormy clouds (talk) 17:50, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Soccer is the most important thing in the world. The article has a well referenced wall of tables, a brief prose summary which is also sourced. Open wide for some soccer! --LaserLegs (talk) 20:36, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support per Masem's arguments on WT:ITNR. Banedon (talk) 23:06, 9 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted Step hen 02:38, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] Lula imprisoned

Support - Former head of state of Brazil. Jusdafax (talk) 00:47, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose solely on article quality. Referencing is quite poor on the BLP and has gaps on the other article. -Ad Orientem (talk) 00:58, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose We already posted when he was convicted (last July). While the circumstances here are a bit odd - he missed a court date to turn himself in and spend two days hiding before he turned himself in - we don't usually cover when sentences of established convinctions start. --Masem (t) 01:14, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose: As said, we have already covered this when he was sentenced. The sentence turning into actual prison is just a trivial consequence; Lula was not detained back then because the lawyers were delaying it with their tricks. This may had been newsworthy if the PT insisted to "resist" the arrest and the whole thing turned into an open conflict for some days, or something like that (and then justifying a specific article), but that was not the case. He resisted the arrest for just some hours, and then gave up without major incidents. Cambalachero (talk) 04:05, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose: Has been previously included ITN.----ZiaLater (talk) 23:47, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] RD: Yaser Murtaja

Comment did he die yesterday or today? The article's not clear. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:32, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Respond This article says Friday. Could you add that? (IPs aren't allowed to directly edit articles on this topic.) Thanks. -- BobTheIP editing as 88.111.218.152 (talk) 21:35, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. It's unclear to me from the article whether or not this journalist was notable prior to his death. Espresso Addict (talk) 23:17, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Most of the article is about his death. Aiken D 23:20, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Another RD where the article was only created after the subject's death. Whilst his death was certainly part of a notable event, it doesn't appear that he was notable himself beforehand. Every source in the article is dated today. I suspect if this was to be AfD'd, it would not survive via WP:BLP1E. Black Kite (talk) 23:24, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] 2018 Münster vehicle ramming

Oppose Doesn't appear to be a terrorist attack, probably doesn't rise to the importance of an ITN item. Black Kite (talk) 19:40, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose No indication this is terrorism – appears to be an individual with mental health problems. Pawnkingthree (talk) 19:53, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose stub. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:33, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose doesn't seem to be terror-related; casualties are (thankfully) very low. EternalNomad (talk) 23:56, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] Humboldt Broncos bus crash

Oppose I have serious doubts about the notability of this topic. While it is undoubtedly getting a lot of immediate attention, I suspect that this is not going to pass SUSTAINED and I'm not seeing the long term significance of this, admittedly tragic event. Once again we have people rushing to create articles about whatever is in the news w/o consideration for whether the subject is likely to meet our guidelines. -Ad Orientem (talk) 14:24, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I have opened a discussion on the article's talk page. -Ad Orientem (talk) 14:32, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Neutral I am withdrawing my oppose. After spending some time looking at traffic safety (and death) statistics for developed countries I now believe that the number of fatalities in this case is so far outside the norm as to establish notability. That said I do think we should have a discussion about setting some kind of rough guidelines about disaster related nominations. But that is a separate issue. -Ad Orientem (talk) 16:29, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support Top of my news feed this morning. It's in the news. So was a prison fire in Venezuela, a mall fire in Russia, a shooting in France, a suicide bombing in Afghanistan, a package bomber in the USA (very briefly, as we know, the USA sucks), a plane crash in Nepal, a fire in Azerbaijan, and a terrorist attack in Burkina Faso. A bridge collapse in Miami was not posted. That's just for March. Yes WP:OSE but in the absence of WP:MINIMUMDEATHS Opposes should explain what (other than happening in Canada) makes this tragedy any different from the endless parade of utterly irrelevant barely above stub disaster stories pushed to ITN on a weekly basis. --LaserLegs (talk) 14:36, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

With the likely exception of the terrorist bombing, I think I can see arguments for the long term significance of most of the events you cited. This looks like a really awful traffic accident to me. But that's pretty much all I'm seeing right now. Maybe some new highway safety regulations will emerge from this, but at the moment I'm not seeing that as likely. -Ad Orientem (talk) 14:42, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Long term significance of a prison fire in Venezuela? Really? Five years from now that article will be within 50 words of what it is today. I think these disaster stories are totally over-represented at ITN, but rather than editorialize, I rely simply on them being "in the news". Wanna stop it? (I DO!) start an RFC. --LaserLegs (talk) 14:46, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

A bad fire in a prison almost always has long term significance. Even if there is no call for safety reform, which given the current political situation in the workers paradise that is Venezuela, does seem unlikely; it has already become part of the broader story about that country's slide into far left authoritarian dictatorship. I have no real doubts about its notability. -Ad Orientem (talk) 14:57, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support given that this is the kind of stuff that gets usually posted (+ various sports events), this one should be posted, too. In the meantime, we keep ignoring the really important developments (Saudi-Arabia, Ethiopia etc. etc.). Daily Mail, not an encyclopedia. 2A02:A451:8B2D:1:B40E:B531:60CB:8185 (talk) 15:12, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Cpmment I have no real opinion on posting this or not, but as a general note regarding notability or otherwise I recommend examining the public domain highways accident reports over many decades from the US National Transportation Safety Board. The bottom line being when you get a very large mass casualty vehicle accident in a developed nation you can usually expect lasting significance because there tend to be regulatory proposals and the like come out of them, many of which go on to become actual laws. Not that it's guaranteed to be the case by any means but it's worth having at the back of one's mind. -- BobTheIP editing as 88.111.218.152 (talk) 17:27, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I fail to see the long-term impact. Who cares?Zigzig20s (talk) 17:37, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- This is the worst sports-related disaster in Canada's history. Argument with no basis is also sociopathically disrespectful. Shocking! 2600:387:5:805:0:0:0:A4 (talk) 21:30, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Large death toll for a vehicular accident; comparable to the 2018 Hong Kong bus accident, which we posted without question. Notability is boosted by the fact that it involved a notable sports team. EternalNomad (talk) 18:41, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support per EternalNomad. Article quality is sufficient. Pawnkingthree (talk) 18:51, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support although I admit I am slightly biased as I'm one of the editors working on the article. The article is currently sufficient and will be expanded once more information is released (the victims names are slowly being released, for example, but they won't be added until confirmed by a better source than Twitter). With regards to the argument about this event's notability, I don't believe it has merit. This event meets the WP:GNG and will almost certainly have longstanding repercussions for the community, province, team and hockey league. Perhaps not world-changing effects, but effects nevertheless. It is also well in-line with other minor events that have received articles and been posted to ITN. --Plasma Twa 2 19:28, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Article is in good shape and is certainly in the news. GrossesWasser (talk) 21:22, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Weak support the juxtaposition of a large road traffic accident in somewhere like Canada, combined with the drastic loss of a large proportion of a single sporting team, makes this notable enough for me. The article is sufficient, the blurb, however, is not. It needs to link in bold text the target article, and the most recent update is that 15 people have sadly died. Other than that, it's good to go. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:37, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. I see consensus for this but there needs to be a reference for the updated death toll. Espresso Addict (talk) 23:10, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Ping Template:Done I added one. --BobTheIP editing as 88.111.218.152 (talk) 23:20, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Posted. Black Kite (talk) 23:25, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think Black Kite and I tried to post it at the same time. :) 331dot (talk) 23:27, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Me too! Espresso Addict (talk) 01:12, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted to Ongoing] Ongoing: 2018 Gaza border protests

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2018 April 6 Template:Cob

Support - Being updated all along. Sherenk1 (talk) 12:05, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - It's receiving edits every some minutes. --Mhhossein ^talk 13:54, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose already posted as a blurb when this was truly in the news. Now little is happening, by the standards of this region of the world. 2A02:A451:8B2D:1:B40E:B531:60CB:8185 (talk) 14:16, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. No opinion on ongoing worthiness, but the wording needs considerable care. The blurb had ongoing arguments at Errors almost its entire tenure. Espresso Addict (talk) 19:41, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Still showing up in Current events; good article. Nixinova T C 06:09, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Since the only oppose is by somebody with some rather sarcastic things to say about current events/ITN, I'm marking as ready. -- BobTheIP editing as 2.28.13.227 (talk) 17:09, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support — Active story that is developing daily.--Carwil (talk) 20:24, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted Step hen 23:21, 8 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

April 6

[Closed] RD: Daniel Akaka

Comment there are a lot of problems right now, and unfortunately I won't be able to do any work to fix it. power~enwiki (π, ν) 20:39, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Should be better now, but not good enough yet. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:25, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. I'm troubled by the fact that the detail of his wife's name (Millie Akaka in the legend, Mary Chong in the infobox) is unclear and his marriage isn't mentioned in the text. Not itself necessarily a huge problem but I think it's indicative of a patchy article with big gaps in coverage. Many achievements mentioned in obits are not in the article, giving undue weight to the Time article assessment. Espresso Addict (talk) 19:36, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] RD:Cecil Taylor

Template:Archive-top Template:ITN candidate

Support. Agree, do not seem to be any sourcing issues. Discography is at a separate article. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:51, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Posted. Espresso Addict (talk) 19:25, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] Former S. Korean President sentenced to 24 years for corruption

Support A news on sentencing a former head of state to 24 years in prison for corruption is a big deal that merits inclusion and it even deserves an update in a separate (sub)section of the article.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 14:08, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support on principle, oppose on quality - Noted that there was a nomination for her arrest which was not posted (appropriately), this is the right point to post. However, I feel the article's organization (why she was on trial comes before anything that discusses her impeachment and why she was arrested) and the major block of text of CNs require improvement here before posting. --Masem (t) 14:15, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
per Masem, in principle yes, but not of sufficient quality to support yet. Only the lede appears to have been updated so far, not the appropriate section of the article itself.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 14:19, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose has been maintenance-tagged since late-2016. Not good enough for a BLP, let alone for one being targeted on the main page. The Rambling Man (talk) 14:25, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose on quality – 25 Template:T tags! Nixinova T C 19:33, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah it needs work. FTR I added most of those CN tags. -Ad Orientem (talk) 22:01, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Archive-bottom

April 5

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2018 April 5 Template:Cob

[Posted] RD: Frederick D. Reese

Support looks fine. The Rambling Man (talk) 07:54, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted -Ad Orientem (talk) 22:06, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] RD: Isao Takahata

Oppose article is a disaster. The Rambling Man (talk) 07:54, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Incredibly saddening, but not going to be featured at the current state. I'll see if I can work on it. Alex Shih (talk) 08:03, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

*Oppose. It is in a terrible state, orange tags on every section aside from the lead itself for over two years. It's going to need just about a complete re-write to even begin to approach front page standards. It's a depressing sight. Challenger l (talk) 11:58, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. What a truly horrific article.--WaltCip (talk) 13:23, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Update I have rewritten and sourced the prose at least to a respectable degree (nothing close to Miyazaki's but enough to pass quality). I'm going to try to source the TV/Film sections now, but I did want to highlight the biggest problems have been fixed. --Masem (t) 20:51, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- And now except for a few early non-notable flms, have those all sourced. --Masem (t) 21:25, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Any comments on the revised version? Espresso Addict (talk) 00:06, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Article has been well fixed up and the article is overall well sourced for posting. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 03:20, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted. Thanks, Masem. Espresso Addict (talk) 03:51, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support article has been cleaned up to an acceptable standard. Nixinova T C 07:50, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Masem and others, you've done great work here! Challenger l (talk) 12:01, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] RD: Eric Bristow

Comment. It's going to need a fair amount of sourcing work. Espresso Addict (talk) 21:20, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. This is like trying to hit 101 or more with 6 darts. Hardly anything is sourced, and it seems a whole "Early life" section (ie: where was he born, where did he grow up, how did he get into darts) is missing. Still, if anyone does it, they can have a speedboat. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 21:33, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed. It's a challenge, and a terrible one to consider that Bristow, before Taylor, was simply unparalleled. And yet his article is a junkyard. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:35, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I started trying to source the first sentence in the body (winning the 1980 Championship against Bobby George) and got bogged down really quickly. If I can't plug in sources like I'm felling trees on this one, it's not going to happen unless everyone pitches in. At the moment, people seem to be fiddling around the wording (and in some instances adding even more unsourced content!), that's great, but for a BLP (which technically this is of course), it's the referencing that's the priority. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 21:37, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I have a pre-dawn start, but perhaps I can join back in on my own nom (cue cheers from the maniacal peanut tossers) tomorrow. Buenos noches. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:45, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose at the moment due to poor referencing. Will support if article cleaned up.Capitalistroadster (talk) 22:21, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Terrible article. Normally I don't mind pitching in with referencing, but what are we to do with stuff like " Bristow had not only supreme talent for one so young but an imposing personality and uncontained self belief."? Needs a major re-write.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 12:58, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

True, but it's difficult to just let go, isn't it. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:07, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Removed] Remove Ongoing: Turkish military operation in Afrin

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2018 April 4 Template:Cob

Support per nomination. --Joseph (talk) 19:13, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support I'm looking for something that's in there that happened in April..... The Rambling Man (talk) 20:46, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Template:Ping just to clarify-- are you opposing removal? Or opposing it staying on ITN? Spencer^T♦C 00:42, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - Gah, adjusted. The Rambling Man (talk) 05:09, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support removal. Per nom. Spencer^T♦C 00:42, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Removed Step hen 05:15, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment No updated info after 25 March. The operation look like it is in low activity now.--Nizil (talk) 05:29, 6 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

April 4

RD: Johnny Valiant

Meh Sourcing isn't so good and there are POV problems. But as a guy who likes to inform people about wrestling history and was pinged here, I feel compelled to say go for it. Nothing jumps out as blatantly false (though I'm no Johnny V expert). InedibleHulk (talk) 10:41, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose The career section needs a lot more referencing work.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 15:32, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] RD: Ray Wilkins

Oppose for now a fine gent but this article is not in a state to be posted. The removal of unsourced content (a huge problem for players who played before the Internet age) has reduced this entry into bare bones, his whole career after Chelsea (which included Manchester United, Milan and PSG) is one sentence. 84 international caps are described in one sentence and I've only just doubled the international section by adding his World Cup red card. Harambe Walks (talk) 16:50, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Changing to Support based on sufficient sourcing for a post Harambe Walks (talk) 20:33, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support What is there seems sufficient and well-sourced. Aiken D 19:44, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Article well sourced. G2g. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:00, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - and we are ready to go. Stormy clouds (talk) 21:04, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment good work from Template:U, Template:U, Template:U, Template:U and Template:U on this. It's been a while since one of these RDs got to me, but this one really did. Thanks again. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:10, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Template:U, time to post please. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:25, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted. Espresso Addict (talk) 21:47, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] Ongoing: 2018 Commonwealth Games

Comment target article has some referencing issues, and isn't suitable for ongoing because it's not getting regular updates. If there is a medals article or something then nominate that. Or if you want, nom the opening for a blurb. --LaserLegs (talk) 14:28, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

It's not getting regular updates because all that's happened so far is the opening ceremony. That was last night. It's 8:20 am on the first day of competition right now. Not many medals awarded so far. Please give it time. HiLo48 (talk) 22:22, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think a blurb "The Commonwealth Games opens in Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia." would be better, then we can move to ongoing once this drops off the template if there are continuous updates. --LukeSurl^{t c} 15:43, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

~~:* Agreed. There will obviously be continuous updates so it's a no-brainer for ongoing but no obejctions to posting it as a blurb first. Black Kite (talk) 22:57, 4 April 2018 (UTC)~~[reply]

Comment. The ongoing target of Chronological summary of the 2018 Commonwealth Games is orange-level tagged for lack of references. ETA: Don't we usually bold opening ceremony for blurbs? 2018 Commonwealth Games opening ceremony is barely a stub. Espresso Addict (talk) 01:21, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose as I did four years ago. [34] Except for the Olympics I don't feel sports events are what Ongoing was intended for, especially regional/otherwise limited entry criteria ones like this. When did we take out this event from ITNR? I would be more comfortable posting a blurb. 331dot (talk) 07:55, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per 331dot.--WaltCip (talk) 11:41, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I concur with 331dot that the Olympics (and probably the World Cup) are more suited for Ongoing. This event does not rise to that level. Lepricavark (talk) 16:30, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] 2018 Commonwealth Games

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2018 April 3 Template:Cob

Blurb is definitely better than ongoing in this case. However, the article does not appear updated, nothing about the opening ceremony, for example (I know there is a separate article, but even that one is very short). --Tone 13:46, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I've copied across the information and links from the sub-articles, this should be sufficient - we don't want to make the main article too long. Black Kite (talk) 14:22, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Yes, better than an ongoing, now I've thought about it a while. Biggest multi-sport event outside the Olympics. Black Kite (talk) 13:47, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support per Black Kite. Article looks sufficiently updated now.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 14:38, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support good to go. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:44, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted, with the top-level article; neither the chronological summary nor the opening ceremony is of sufficient quality yet. Espresso Addict (talk) 20:54, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

April 3

[Closed] YouTube headquarters shooting

Oppose no impact, nothing will change, only the perp died. The Rambling Man (talk) 10:53, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

And her videos were taken down. InedibleHulk (talk) 11:12, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Snow close.--WaltCip (talk) 10:53, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Weak support I know we don't usually post items with a low number of casualties, but there are unusual circumstances here - a female shooter and a high-profile company targeted.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 14:01, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Snow close 100% domestic non-terrorism related incident, fails basic ITN for such events. --Masem (t) 14:03, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support News sources are covering the story in detail, article is of sufficient depth and quality and referencing looks good. --Jayron 32 14:09, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Nowhere in ITN criteria does it say we reject news for having too low a death toll, or being domestic terrorism, or what have you. This is in the news and it's a quality article. Opposers are forgetting the purpose of ITN is to promote good, updated content on items that are in the news. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:15, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- We have to be fully aware of the media affect here, and remember that Youtube is part of the media community. They are of course going to highlight this big time, but this is nothing at all close to the Charlie Hebdo shooting from a few years back. There's a huge media bias in why this story is being covered as deeply as it is, is that it affected one of the media's "own". If this was any other random workplace without the name "YouTube", the coverage would be non-existent. --Masem (t) 14:21, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - This is not importance perceived of event x. The criteria is set out for ITN, and that is is there reliable, in-depth news coverage of an event. Comparison to other similar events has zero bearing on this nomination. All nominations are held on their own merits not on a scale of comparison. WTKitty (talk) 14:31, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
    - ITN is not a news ticker. We do curate to avoid bias created by media . --Masem (t) 14:34, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
      - That's right. Which is why we evaluate article quality and merely use the news to decide if people are likely to be hearing about this story outside of Wikipedia. By trying to "curate" the list based on your own views of what should, and should not, be important, you are treating this as a news ticker. You are merely trying to curate your own news ticker and control what stories people do and don't see based on your own editorial opinion of what we should and should not find important. That's a news ticker. If instead we just put up good articles about current events that's what we should be doing. "I don't think the news should cover this" is not a criteria for ITN. Bias is not avoided by refusing to acknowledge work created by Wikipedia editors just because you don't like where those editors live. Two biases are not a correction. Instead, just write articles yourself from underrepresented areas. --Jayron 32 14:38, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        Actually, the point here is that gun crime occurs all the time in the US, and in this case only one person died, the perp. That it happened at YouTube is trivia. The event is borderline trivia, probably better covered in a long list of this year's shootings. Posting this would actively open floodgates for every single trivial gun event in the US that receives a day's news coverage. Which would be junk. The Rambling Man (talk) 14:43, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        
        If we strictly only went by media coverage and a sufficient update to an article for quality, then ITN would be flooded by Trump-related stories. We have to recognize that the media has its own focus that is different from the goals of an encyclopedia. We do need to curate, and understand that even if a story is the leading headline for all major papers, it may not be appropriate for Wikipedia (NOT#NEWS still exists and is still consider valid) nor ITN's front page, even if the update and quality to the article are there. We try to avoid geographical biases, but we also need to try to avoid topic-area biases too that are generated by the media. This is one of those cases. --Masem (t) 14:48, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        This is larger than just "gun crime in the U.S.", as it is a female shooter (you have to acknowledge how rare that is) and that it's (apparently) over the issue of the monetization of her videos. So many U.S. shootings don't get articles, let alone nominated here at ITN. Sometimes, they're worth posting. Like Parkland, Newtown, Sutherland Springs, and I think this too. – Muboshgu (talk) 15:27, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        How does the shooter being female impact the newsworthiness of the story, other than that it's a statistical anomaly? Answer: It doesn't. The conclusion is still the same - guns are ridiculously easy to get a hold of in the U.S., and mass shootings are pervasively frequent as a result.--WaltCip (talk) 15:46, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        And that right there brings us back to the crux of the matter: U.S.-related stories are being rejected by editors not on their merits, but on the idea that mass shootings are "pervasively frequent". Not all of them are nominated, but somehow, their frequency means they all need to be rejected? – Muboshgu (talk) 15:50, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
        And right there you hit the nail on the head again, we have lists and lists of mass shootings, this one is not unique, is not interesting, is not important, is not going to change anything, and will be forgotten in moments. We don't reject them all by any means, that's an absurd accusation. Promoting this is the quickest way to junk ITN with a proliferation of totally meaningless shoot-em-up's in the United States on the main page. Perhaps start an American Wikipedia where you could have a mass shooting ticker instead? It would be frequently updated, like another RD line? The Rambling Man (talk) 18:42, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I may support the nomination, but the reasons of this incident are not elaborated. The article says that she claims that Youtube "demonetized most of her videos", and that can be easily understood as an action over an individual user. Actually, the requirements of AdSense have changed: before, you needed to have a channel with at least 10,000 views in total, now you need 4,000 hours of watch time in the last year and at least 1,000 subscribers. A significant number of Youtube video creators do not meet those draconian requirements and ceased to receive monetization; this woman was just one of them. Of course, it does not justify her, but it gives context. See here: How YouTube creators get paid for ads and why some have been angry. Cambalachero (talk) 14:35, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- No offense, but YouTube stiffing a few of its less productive users a few bucks is not the same thing as the U.S. declaring Israel a sovereign state.--WaltCip (talk) 15:47, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Snow Close no long term impact. SamaranEmerald (talk) 15:56, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Can people please stop saying "snow close"? That's not going to happen when there are four supports so far.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 16:04, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support. And no need to leave out "Iranian-born" in the lede.Zigzig20s (talk) 16:02, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose we can’t post EVERY mass shooting that occurs in the U.S, Wikipedia is not U.S-centric even if it gets widespread coverage. Kirliator (talk) 16:06, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose while Pawnkingthree is absolutely right that this does not qualify for a snow close, I don't think it qualifies for an ITN posting either. This is a relatively minor incident with minimal impact. Lepricavark (talk) 16:09, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per all above opposers, a minor shooting at best. In addition, I don’t recall a previous posting where the shooting had no fatalities other than the perpetrator, though correct me if I’m wrong. Hornetzilla78 (talk) 16:13, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The thing is it happened at Youtube. Millions (maybe hundreds of millions?) of people use youtube every day. That makes it more ITN-worthy in my opinion. The only real argument for not posting it may be that we obviously don't want to encourage copycats. We may need to have a real conversation about this--what does law enforcement think--should we avoid "promoting" these stories? But they are all over the newspapers.Zigzig20s (talk) 16:25, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Widespread news coverage does not automatically mean this event warrants an ITN post, as there is no formal criteria. I have seen posts make it to ITN with barely any coverage, and get posted. Likewise, there have been countless times where events on the ITN nominations received international coverage, yet failed to get posted on the bulletin. Hornetzilla78 (talk) 16:32, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

That's not the point I'm making at all. I'm saying Youtube makes it ITN-worthy IMO.Zigzig20s (talk) 19:38, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose This would set a very dangerous precedent into posting any shooting that happens around the world. We generally only post shootings/attacks with significant casualties or large ramifications (such as the Poisoning of Sergei and Yulia Skripal, or the assassination of a major political figure), and I don't think this meets either. EternalNomad (talk) 18:36, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose, minor shooting, no long-term impact. Kaldari (talk) 18:37, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I was pleasantly surprised when I saw soon after the shooting that no one had tried to ITN it. I guess my surprise was too soon. This is a minor incident. Things like this happen all the time. The only person dead was the shooter. Natureium (talk) 19:27, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed, and the absolutely incredible (and by that I mean it in its literal sense) thing is that we have two admins voting in favour of posting it. Seriously. Who's watching the watchmen these days? The Rambling Man (talk) 19:37, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, and for the record, contrary to what one of these admins has claimed (Template:Xt), some of us are all too aware of what should and should not go onto ITN, and while this article might be of decent quality, the news item it relates to is trivial and of limited interest to a handful of individuals in a small region on the planet who can't control themselves and their guns. Instantly forgettable fodder. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:28, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support it's a rather unusual shooting, and in the news, internationally. 2A02:A451:8B2D:1:D50F:2978:62F9:C48D (talk) 19:40, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
It's unusual because the shooter only managed to kill herself? No big deal. The Rambling Man (talk) 19:42, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose the only real reason why this event is getting widespread coverage is because YouTube is mentioned, if this wasn't YouTube or any other major business or corporation, this would not be on the board. Python Dan (talk) 20:11, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - Much hype, not so much significance, zero deaths (the perp doesn't count). This is a blip, nothing more. --Bongwarrior (talk) 20:16, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] April 2018 North American storm complex

Template:Atop Template:ITN candidate --Jax 0677 (talk) 22:18, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

What storm complex? Where? What has been the damage? Have there been any casualties?--WaltCip (talk) 22:19, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose weather impacting a few, mildly, and non-notable weather at that. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:23, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose stub. Story is in the news, event is relatively rare, advanced building codes, enforcement, communications and emergency management in the United States means death toll and damage are relatively low (and WP:MINIMUMDEATHS isn't a thing). But ... it's barely a stub. --22:28, 3 April 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by LaserLegs (talk • contribs)
Oppose, don't we have a Wikiweather or Wikimeteo or something? LjL (talk) 22:33, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose, this is the kind of ITN post that's literally destined to snow. SamaranEmerald (talk) 23:20, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose, people in a first-world country are inconvenienced due to unusual weather, news at 11. This is not at all appropriate for an ITN. --Masem (t) 23:31, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- People in a developing nation are killed due to usual weather? OMG deaths? --LaserLegs (talk) 01:15, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] RD: Lill-Babs

Template:Archive-top Template:ITN candidate

Question Why is there no list of works? Surely she released something in her career? "she acted in several films"? Nice job on the cleanup BabbaQ. --LaserLegs (talk) 13:42, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I have added Filmography and Discography. Thanks.BabbaQ (talk) 13:59, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Nice work.

Support GTG. --LaserLegs (talk) 14:07, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Looks ready. --Pawnkingthree (talk) 14:45, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support fine. The Rambling Man (talk) 15:58, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted. Spencer^T♦C 16:51, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] April 2018 caste protests in India

Support as a updater. I would prefer it in ongoing events instead of blurb. I have also proposed alternative blurb which does not focus on number of deaths. ALT2 uses SC/ST caste groups instead of term Dalit because it is unrecognized term by the government and definition of Dalit sometimes do not include ST caste groups. The protests are against the court order on the SC/ST atrocities act, not government. So I had proposed ALT1.--Nizil (talk) 12:58, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose remove the "Background" section and you have a sub-stub sized article. Needs expansion about the actual event. The Rambling Man (talk) 16:00, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- The article has expanded significantly since Tuesday. Kaldari (talk) 18:40, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support as a updater. It received global news coverage. --Uncle Sargam (talk) 08:42, 7 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Archive-bottom

April 2

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2018 April 2 Template:Cob

[Posted] RD: Connie Lawn

Weak oppose It's basically a stub. For someone with a 50-year career I would expect there to be enough out there for a little expansion. If this could be done I will switch to support.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 18:44, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Switching to Support as Dumelow has added some more career details as I requested - thanks.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 19:53, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support article seems sufficient and well-sourced. Aiken D 19:46, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support It's good enough and long enough for the main page. It's 3,000 characters of prose, which is a Start-class article. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:48, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

To be fair to Pawnkingthree it was shorter when I nominated it, I have since expanded the article - Dumelow (talk) 19:53, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Very good then. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:00, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support good to go, definitely not a stub, that template removed. The Rambling Man (talk) 19:54, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted. Espresso Addict (talk) 21:06, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] 2018 NCAA Division I Men's Basketball Tournament

Support –Article in decent shape and updated. Item is ITNR, this looks ready to go. –Ammarpad (talk) 03:31, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment as per other sport ITNRs we need a better /larger summary of the game; additionally, factors such as broadcaster, estimated audiance, etc. should also be included. --Masem (t) 03:43, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
References needed on many tables, heats, and broadcasts. Stephen 03:48, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Template:Re The pages will do need some work and should be totally up to speed by some time tomorrow at the latest. Especially as more is written about the championship game and the winning team. – Muboshgu (talk) 04:10, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: the NCAA Women's Tournament should be included. It was last year. — Wylie pedia @ 06:41, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Last year's women's was significant because it halted Connecticut's 111-game winning streak. If this year's is not ready, especially since the women's is not in the ITNR either, it should not hold up the nomination.—Bagumba (talk) 12:24, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support posting the Men's Tournament once it is judged to be ready. I strongly oppose posting the Women's Tournament because it's just not that big of a deal even in America. It should not have been posted last year, either. Lepricavark (talk) 14:14, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I see no reason not to include the Woman's results (though that game also has need of updates). It is standard practice that if there are both men's and women's divisions of a sport finale happening effectively at the same time that we should post both. I know the Women's NCAA has nowhere close to the viewership of the Men's, but if we're posting the Men's, it's systematic bias to not post the Women's that ended the day before. --Masem (t) 14:21, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

It is not systemic bias to refrain from posting something that is not receiving sufficient attention even in its own country. The reality is that the Women's Tournament does not receive nearly the same level of news coverage as the Men's Tournament. Most American sports fans don't care about the Women's Tournament and it would be an insult to our readers to pretend otherwise. Lepricavark (talk) 16:26, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I second this. The only reason to post the women's tournament is to right a great wrong. It's unfortunate it does not get the same attention as the men, but it just does not. 331dot (talk) 20:37, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose Game summary is too short and missing a ref. The tournament article is terrible, so you'll need to unbold it. --LaserLegs (talk) 15:33, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Support I don't know or care enough about sports to decide if the game summary is adequate, but it's refed well enough for me. Nice work. --LaserLegs (talk) 20:41, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per LaserLegs. The Rambling Man (talk) 16:00, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Template:Re The game summary is lengthened, should be long enough. I've added the broadcasters, crowd size at the Alamodome, and the overnight ratings. I'll debold the tourney article and remove it from the template, since I don't have the time to work on it today and it shouldn't hold up the game article. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:43, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support now that improvements have been made.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 18:46, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support with the new expansion. --Masem (t) 18:48, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment meh, it's a naff expansion, but probably enough. What I am interested in is the wording on ITNR about these men/women events, which explicitly states Template:Xt and as far as I can see, there's nothing specifying that the women's event should not be listed. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:24, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The tournaments started and ended on different days and occurred in different locations(The final games were in Columbus, Ohio for the women and San Antonio, Texas for the men) I usually take "simultaneous" to mean the same time in the same location. 331dot (talk) 20:34, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I understand what "simultaneous" means, but I allowed it some latitude because clearly those who added it to ITNR meant, in spirit, "in the same timeframe", like the Boat Race (yeah, yeah) where the women's race takes place an hour before the men's, that's not simultaneous but it it was is meant. I very much doubt that any sporting contest holds a men's and women's final simultaneously per the dicdef, so we need to use our common sense here. I'm not sure why the location is relevant in the slightest. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:37, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I guess my view is that the locations(in this case, not even the same state) suggest that we are talking about two different events. But I don't feel particularly strongly about it. 331dot (talk) 20:43, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Well clearly they're two different events (like the two different senior Boat Races), they just aren't collocated. If we need to change the wording at ITNR, then I suggest you make a proposal, because right now there's nothing really (barring the use of common sense) to exclude the women's final, apart from all the personal opinions above. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:45, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough. Thanks 331dot (talk) 22:11, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Common sense should be a good enough reason to refrain from posting something that is not actually in the news. Lepricavark (talk) 00:45, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Marking ready since opposes are now supports, except for TRM who updated his oppose to a "meh". – Muboshgu (talk) 23:44, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted Step hen 01:09, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] Discovery of Icarus, farther detected star

Comment. Prepared to support in principle, based on sources in the article, but we really need a developed article to evaluate. Espresso Addict (talk) 00:44, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment this is the kind of thing which professional astronomers look at as a curio, but if the general public likes it, why not? Banedon (talk) 02:01, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support and could we get an image of this star on the main page too? That would be awesome! Brian Everlasting (talk) 09:08, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - ready for posting.BabbaQ (talk) 13:34, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose at the moment, two paragraphs makes this a stub article. The Rambling Man (talk) 16:02, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment News indicate this is the most distant known star ever, not just the main sequence star, so I've adjusted the blurb. Brandmeister^talk 16:05, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Depends on whether you call a supernova a "star". Some people probably will, and others will not. Calling it a main sequence star is indisputably correct, but it's somewhat technical. Banedon (talk) 23:48, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose per TRM, stub article. SamaranEmerald (talk) 16:16, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
This article is now four paragraphs and offers a rather complete overview of the topic given available information, so it's closer to B-class than a stub. Mamyles (talk) 17:12, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted Article quality issues seem to have since been addressed. --Jayron 32 17:58, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Post-Posting Comment I support this; however, it is kind of in geocentric language with the language of "the farthest-known star, 9 billion light-years away." I think it should specify that it is 9 billion light-years away *from earth* and make some indication that this is the farthest *detected* star as opposed to the farthest-known star. Is it farthest or furthest? Granted these are a bit nit-picky; I understand that basically every person who uses Wikipedia is from Earth, but the language used implies humans and earth is the center of the universe and "we" are the only place with so-far discovered life and therefore, find it reasonable to make a measurement without specifying that Earth is the starting point in our line of analysis.

So I likely confused you all. What I would propose for the wording is "Astronomers report the discovery of MACS J1149 Lensed Star 1, nicknamed Icarus (detection pictured), becoming the farthest-detected star by humans at 9 billion light-years away from Earth."

I also added "by humans" to indicate who it was detected by. Should we say something else like a telescope, a satellite, machinery, etc.? We could say "with the aid of technology" or something like that.

Note: I am working under the assumption (of the possibility) that life exists outside of Earth and that is why I am being particular in decentering earthly human experience. TenorTwelve (talk) 00:07, 5 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

China retaliates to US tariffs

Comment Worth a nomination for ongoing? Black Kite (talk) 23:46, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I don't mind (feel free to change the nomination however you see fit; I don't own it) but I think it's better to make it a blurb and roll it into ongoing if it continues to make the news. Banedon (talk) 23:52, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support - Absolutely make ongoing. The international economy is in for a real turbulent time.--WaltCip (talk) 01:27, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment No way is that a neutral article title. I see a few sources using it, but nowhere close to universal to comply with BLP, but that's a heck of a WP:NEO and should be avoided. --Masem (t) 03:46, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Template:Ping Taking no position on the name, but the reasons for it are explained at Talk:Trump_tariffs#Re-name to "Trump Administration tariffs" or some such?. Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 05:24, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - My concern is that those cases have a matter of decades of historical record to establish those names. This is neogolism that we have no idea if it will hold. It might, in the far future, but not now. --Masem (t) 06:08, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - Referenced. Sherenk1 (talk) 04:54, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - decent article (I did add one fact tag), certainly in the news. Interesting when it was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:In_the_news/Candidates/March_2018#[Closed]_Trump_announces_tariffs_on_China nominated previously not only was it "snow closed" but a nom was actually proposed to limit "Trump" related postings. The Chinese response is an incremental update to THE EXACT SAME THING. LOL. --LaserLegs (talk) 13:12, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - I think the blurb is wrong. The China response is Trump's specific tariffs on a number of Chinese products from last week; the steel/aluminium tariff applies worldwide and was announced back in March 1. --Masem (t) 14:03, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- That, or the article is not updated properly; the China response in the article is in the section about the China-specific tariffs, but checking news articles, it seems China was already going after tariffs with the steel/aluminium ones. There's a disconnect that needs to be fixed here. --Masem (t) 14:08, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose tit-for-tat retaliation, small beans in financial terms, minor tremors on the financial markets but hardly ground-breaking at all. The Rambling Man (talk) 14:04, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Implementing and retaliating against tariffs happens every year. We've been hearing about tariffs against Chinese dumping for decades. Having a connection to an unpopular figure does not make this incident more notable than others. Mamyles (talk) 17:21, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - per TRM, who has provided a succinct synopsis of this entire situation. Stormy clouds (talk) 18:30, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment – It's definitely figured prominently in Eng-lang news for a couple days, but it might be more appropriate in 'Ongoing.' (If a blurb were to be posted, I'd make it "retaliates against" stedda "to.") Sca (talk) 20:32, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support for ongoing only and the target should obviously be Trump tariffs. Brian Everlasting (talk) 04:06, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support for either blurb or ongoing per nom. The article is in good shape, and it's a notable development, in a story that we haven't posted yet. Davey2116 (talk) 15:57, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose None of these tariffs have taken effect. China specifically said they hope they can negotiate another outcome that prevents them from taking effect. We'll see how that goes. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:01, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

What makes you say none of these tariffs have taken effect? To quote from the article, "China implemented their tariffs on April 2, 2018." Banedon (talk) 21:44, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose This is relatively minor in the grand scheme of the economies of these two nations. If the situation escalates, we should revisit. But for now, I don't think this is that important. A Quest For Knowledge (talk) 16:05, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] RD: Bob Beattie

Support - Quite short but sufficient. Ready for posting.BabbaQ (talk) 23:06, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted Step hen 00:21, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] RD: Winnie Mandela

Oppose You edit conflicted with me making the nomination, but the article is currently tagged for neutrality. I haven't got time to investigate how serious the problems are. Thryduulf (talk) 14:13, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose until consensus is reached regarding the alleged NPOV issues. For the record, I don't think the article is all that bad, though there are some areas where UNDUE might be an issue. And the opening post on the talk page over this is simply a screed that should have been deleted per NOTFORUM. However there have been posts since then and so we are where we are. -Ad Orientem (talk) 17:02, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
~~Wait~~ - until issues identified above are resolved. However, should this be a blurb discussion? She would pass the Thatcher-Mandela axis, after all, and is a significant figure in the history of South Africa, and the story has occupied ten-fifteen minutes on the main Irish news broadcast, so international significance is clear. Stormy clouds (talk) 17:06, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Tag removed now, so support. Stormy clouds (talk) 18:31, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose - I haven't read the entire article to see what Template:U has mentioned as being biased, whether that assumption is accurate and how to improve it. However, this tag is too important to ignore. Anarcho-authoritarian (talk) 17:09, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - Regretfully. The article has been tagged for neutrality. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:00, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Conditional Support - I think this death is too notable to leave out. However, I do agree the article needs fixing up. I would support posting once the article's issues have been fixed. (NorthernFalcon (talk) 21:15, 2 April 2018 (UTC))[reply]
Support - I've cleaned up the worst of the neutrality issues,especially in the lede, and removed the tag. I doubt the article would ever meet the standards of the neutrality tagger, since she was very controversial, and even sympathetic sources like sahistory.org.za struggle to be hagiographic. Overall, she's a highly significant figure, whose death should make the front page. Park3r (talk) 12:04, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted Step hen 04:14, 4 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Philippine vice presidential election poll recount

Wait. Recounts are not uncommon, though perhaps less so at the national level. If this merits posting at all, it shouldn't be until the recount is completed and if the result is changed. 331dot (talk) 10:06, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Conditional wait for either 3 months (according to Marcos) or 6 months or more (according to Robredo), and if Marcos wins the protest. –H T D 10:55, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Wait. I will support this if Marcos wins the count. Morever, the article looks good and it is good to go. BSrap (talk) 14:46, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Weak oppose sadly, since 1) it might not actually change the outcome of the election and 2) it's for the position of vice president, which is still subordinate to the president. Banedon (talk) 23:28, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Vice presidential election. If there are major protests or other notable reaction, I'm willing to reconsider. Spencer^T♦C 16:53, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Costa Rica election

Support - Article appears to be well-written, sourced and updated. Jusdafax (talk) 06:48, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Note - Infobox is not updated; still speaks of the election in the future tense. --Jayron 32 10:32, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Quality article, presidential elections are generally notable. Calm Omaha (talk) 00:41, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. We have in the past required elections to have at least a paragraph of sourced post-election reactions, which this lacks. ETA: The incoming president's article is also very short and orange-tagged for lack of sources. Espresso Addict (talk) 00:51, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Posted] Tiangong-1

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2018 April 1 Template:Cob

Support Article overall is of decent quality and the relevant section (Tiangong-1#Re-entry) provides solid coverage of the topic. Spencer^T♦C 02:28, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - no issues, article updated, good to go. Mjroots (talk) 03:16, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support: Decent quality; well-referenced. Nixinova T C 03:38, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support Decent article and informative. –Ammarpad (talk) 04:43, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose, no lasting impact. Also, will squat on the list for at least a week after everyone has stopped caring about it. Abductive (reasoning) 05:28, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support. Interesting, updated, informative & in the news. Espresso Addict (talk) 06:02, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose no significance, it died already 2 years ago, and not interesting. zzz (talk) 06:17, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Support - article is good, event is significant and of interest to readers. Stormy clouds (talk) 09:55, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment, "Deorbited" suggests a controlled descent, which this was not. 331dot (talk) 10:09, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Posted slight modification of blurb, based on 331dot's suggestion. --Jayron 32 10:35, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment could we get some indication that this was planned? It reads like it was some freak accident. Brightgalrs (/braɪtˈɡæl.ərˌɛs/)^[ᴛ] 22:28, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- It wasn't planned. China turned off most support for the station in early 2016 but had no plans for how to decommision it, then a few months later, they found it was dropping altitude and they had no control of the station from ground control. Since then, they've been running models after models about when and where it would land on Earth. --Masem (t) 00:36, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
- Per Masem, this was not a planned event. China basically abandoned it two years ago, and left it to do what it will. It just happened to fall back to Earth this week. --Jayron32 13:00, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  - Comment Perhaps "expected" would have been a better word. My complaint still stands. Brightgalrs (/braɪtˈɡæl.ərˌɛs/)^[ᴛ] 23:42, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

April 1

[Closed] RD: Steven Bochco

Support when updated, and he had a lasting impact on American television. Daniel Case (talk) 18:23, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I think this needs quite a lot of work - there are many unsourced statements.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 18:31, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose nowhere near ready for the main page, far too much of it is unreferenced, this is still a BLP. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:39, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per above. Referencing is really quite poor. -Ad Orientem (talk) 02:30, 3 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] RD: Efraín Ríos Montt

Support Good article; has 6 Template:T tags tho. Nixinova T C 21:58, 1 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Orange tags and several sections almost completely unreferenced. Challenger l (talk) 18:22, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose has been tagged since 2013, needs serious work before it could even be realistically considered for main page. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:40, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[Closed] Aman Tuleyev resigns as Governor of Kemerovo (Russia)

This seems like pure ITN, a fire and a relatively minor change in a political position combined Galobtter (pingó mió) 14:08, 1 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose on its own merits, but open to expanding existing blurb without bumping. Stormy clouds (talk) 14:10, 1 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. This longtime official falling on their sword (and who was apparently going to resign soon anyway due to health reasons) doesn't seem significant enough to be posted on its own. Perhaps update the blurb as SC suggests. 331dot (talk) 14:12, 1 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per above, but not opposed to adding to existing blurb. --Masem (t) 14:33, 1 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose local politics don't deserve ITN coverage. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:00, 1 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Local politics. Nixinova T C 21:44, 1 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]