User talk:Doncram

(e) as of Dec2010 as of Dec2014

all clear

All previous discussions archived. Among current watchlist is open Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Naming conventions for United States federal buildings. Perhaps build Talk:U.S. Post Office/NameComparisons? --doncram (talk) 22:06, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Also keep adding CT NRHP pics for the current contest at wp:Connecticut. --doncram (talk) 21:15, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

And again....

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. MSJapan (talk) 06:14, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm gonna shut up now. Lvklock (talk) 17:28, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I lied. Lvklock (talk) 19:35, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Journal Record Building

The DYK project (nominate) 18:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Funny this DYK should come through while some are raking me over the coals at wp:ANI, for having worked on Masonic buildings articles. This particular building is also known as the India Temple Shrine Building. The DYK is courtesy of Orlady, really, who did almost all the development and shared credit generously to me. Thanks! Also of interest are 4 other Masonic buildings in Oklahoma, to three of which i added NRHP document links, following Orlady's example with the India Temple Shrine one. --doncram (talk) 18:23, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Hey!

Hey, if you aren't too busy, do you mind looking at Fort Nassau (North River) and see if you can come with a policy decision at the talk page regarding the proper formatting of the article name. We have two divergent "world-views" and only three editors (including myself) so consensus looks unlikely though everyone is very friendly.Camelbinky (talk) 23:03, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Hunter House Publishers

A tag has been placed on Hunter House Publishers requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section A3 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is an article with no content whatsoever, or whose contents consist only of external links, a "See also" section, book references, category tags, template tags, interwiki links, a rephrasing of the title, or an attempt to contact the subject of the article. Please see Wikipedia:Stub for our minimum information standards for short articles. Also please note that articles must be on notable subjects and should provide references to reliable sources that verify their content. You may wish to consider using a Wizard to help you create articles - see the Article Wizard.

If you think that this notice was placed here in error, you may contest the deletion by adding {{hangon}} to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag - if no such tag exists then the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate and adding a hangon tag is unnecessary), coupled with adding a note on the talk page explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the page does get deleted, you can contact one of these admins to request that they userfy the page or have a copy emailed to you. — Train2104 (talk • contribs • count) 23:25, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Argh. It was deleted, too. I just recreated it. It's easily notable. When stuff like this happens, I happen to think the person nominating an article for deletion is wrong for doing it, not right for forcing another editor to do something more. It causes unnecessary disruption, wasted time and effort. YMMV. --doncram (talk) 00:38, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Masonic buildings

I have high hopes of getting the List of Masonic buildings situation resolved amicably. To avoid inciting additional enmity toward the article, I think it would be an excellent idea for you to refrain from adding new entries unless you have solid verification (i.e., more than a name on a list) that the building was really built, owned, and/or extensively used by a Masonic organization -- and not something unrelated, such as the building occupied by Irving Masonic's dry good store or a place where Boy Scouts worked on their masonry merit badge. 'Nuf said. --Orlady (talk) 01:54, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Your sarcasm is noted, but is unfair. You refer to my additions in this diff of 3 or 4 edits, now completed. There are no Boy Scout or other items in that. These are solid additions, already discussed at the Talk page and all possibly marginal ones screened out in that discussion. Thanks for noticing, I guess. I do in general appreciate your involvement in the mess there, but I don't appreciate the sarcasm and the drumbeat of personally-toned remarks you throw off in my direction. Also i don't see why you have to mention and canvas Polaron, Station1, Dudemanfellabra (who you note have no related involvement) to bring them into the wp:ANI discussion. Seems like bad faith canvassing on your part, trying to drag the discussion down. You commented at my Talk page; i am commenting back. --doncram (talk) 02:02, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm glad to hear that you have verification that the buildings you have added to the list are truly associated with Freemasonry. Considering the vehemence of the opposition that the Freemasonry editors express toward this list of buildings, I think it is wise to avoid giving them any more ammunition at a time when I think there is a chance of achieving a good resolution. Furthermore, experience tells me that bizarre coincidences (such as the hypothetical existence of a person named Irving Masonic who gave his name to a building) have a way of cropping up when we least expect them (and when they can cause us the most problems).

As for the RFC at WP:ANI, at the time I commented the title of that RFC was "Doncram" and the scope was your conduct in general. Only later was it retitled to focus on Masonic buildings. Since the discussion was supposed to be of your conduct in general, that's what I commented on, and I mentioned the names of several other contributors with whom you have been at odds. Since I mentioned their names at WP:ANI, I was required to invite them there. And, BTW, I do think your recent behavior with respect to Hope Valley, Rhode Island and a couple of related places has been reprehensible -- and also that Polaron has behaved badly. --Orlady (talk) 02:46, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

10,001

"You have 10,001 pages on your watchlist (excluding talk pages)." A new high. Mostly historic sites and related list-articles. Mostly quiet pages with very little vandalism. Probably Erie Canal gets the most vandal-type edits from schoolkids presumably. Some churning on the approximately 3,000 dab pages i watch. --doncram (talk) 02:20, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Another one...

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. MSJapan (talk) 02:11, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Canvassing

When asking others to comment on your own proposals, as you did on three project talk pages under headings "style guideline for disambiguation of places", requests should be neutrally worded. While your first sentence is perfectly acceptable, and is all that is needed, the next two sentences are inaccurate and subtly biased toward your viewpoint in my opinion. Please try to keep these requests neutral in the future. Station1 (talk) 04:20, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

This refers to this edit at wp:HSITES and 2 others at wp:GEOGRAPHY and wp:NRHP. I gave explicit notice (and links) regarding my making these announcements at the MOSDAB talk page where I suggested the wording change, for Station1 or anyone else to check. They haven't led to any comments at the talk page, at all! I think that other editors are likely kind of mind-numbed at the boringness of the proposal, which is to make explicit the permission for editors to use sensible order, widely adopted already, in disambiguation pages about places. --doncram (talk) 04:40, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

I do appreciate your giving notice with links at the MOSDAB talk page about the announcements. Station1 (talk) 05:43, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Sts P & P Church address

I'm a coords guy and have left some comments at Talk:National_Register_of_Historic_Places_listings_in_St._Louis_County,_Minnesota#Coordinate_error. You're obviously a NRHP guru and I'm hoping you can answer a question. In coord patrolling I come onto articles about NRHP and other similar government–listed places which have the coords given in the government filing accurately entered, but which do not point to the right place. I don't know whether the government used a different georeference system or (I more suspect) just dead–reckoned it from map sources and missed it, but I do know that the georeference system being used here at WP (WGS84) does not point to the right place if you enter those coordinates into a {{coord}} tag. Would you happen to know if there is a consensus here on whether those coordinates should be left alone to reflect the official record or should be upgraded to ones which actually work here? I'll look for your response here on your talk page. Best regards, TRANSPORTERMAN (TALK) 14:55, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Quick reply: NRHP coords used in articles are sometimes are way off due to outright typos in the version of the National Register's coordinates database that we have used. NRHP coords are often 100 yards or so off due to the 1975 geosystem coordinates change, the North American datum(?) change or something like that. Old NRHP applications show coordinates meticulously measured on old U.S. Geological Survey topo quadrant maps; the map system now used by Google maps and everyone else is now slightly different in most parts of the country; it is the same in Chicago, about 100 yards off in Connecticut, further off in other corners of the U.S. More info at wp:NRHPmos section on coordinates and much about coordinates in the system of webpages at wp:NRIS info issues. For the most part, we just want to fix the coordinates when people have better info, not laboriously report those corrections to the National Register. We do take more effort to report other types of factual errors, and to work with the National Register to fix them. I have to run, may reply more later. --doncram (talk) 15:05, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

	You've been given a cookie, because wow, it's one-stop shopping at the doncram supercenter! I'll look forward to anything you care to add. Thanks, thanks, thanks, and thanks again. Bon appétit, TRANSPORTERMAN (TALK) 15:26, 31 August 2010 (UTC)
	Cookies promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a cookie, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy munching! Spread the goodness of cookies by adding {{subst:Cookie}} to someone's talk page with a friendly message, or eat this cookie on the giver's talk page with {{subst:munch}}!

NRHP PR

one of the Casa Paoli pics contributed by Puerto Rico OPRHP photographer and writer Juan Llanes Santos

Hi doncram, at one point I remember reading you wrote that Llanes had given you permission to use the Casa Paole pics for the DYK nomination last October. I need to review that info for an unrelated matter. Would you kindly direct me to where you put that as my search so far hasn't turn it up. Thanks! Mercy11 (talk) 01:31, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Isnt the name Juan Llanes Santos? I think you won't find any arrangements for it online much. It was arranged by email correspondence. The photos were emailed to me, and, after some back and forth discussion, I uploaded them using the Creative Commons 3.0 license, which specifies that attribution should be given. That was the license best matching their wishes that i could figure out. Juan Llanes Santos was very cooperative and helpful. I believe he secured higher level permission to make the release. It boded well, i thought, for future contributions. I am sure I still have the email correspondence, and I could probably share excerpts at least. If interested in the emails, please email to me, using email-to-me box at my User page. Hope this helps. --doncram (talk) 01:43, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Yes, that name is correct. At this point I don't to get in touch with him. Instead just to review you comments as you recorded them back then. You were euphoric (BTW, I mean that in a good sense!) about you contact and the results. As I recall you wrote to the effect you that permision had been obtained, etc.

BTW, I couldn't understand all of your message above, seems there are som etypos getting in the way. As a reference, the last time you and I touched bases I believe was HERE. But the comments you recorded about Juan Llanes Santos was, in my recollection, much later after that. Any help is appreciated for the length of your Contribs pages got the best of me!... Thanks, Mercy11 (talk) 01:58, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

I think i mentioned it within the copyright issues discussion, at the potential copyvio noticeboard, regarding a number of NRHP photos (which resulted in permission for some of them being obtained, some not). Hnm...found it...i was referring to that within discussion at Q's Talk page, and i think also at the main Possibly unfree files discussion at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree files/2010 June 24#File:Church Nuestra Senora de la Concepcion y San Fernando of Toa Alta.JPG. --doncram (talk) 02:39, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Milhist A-class and Peer Reviews Jul-Dec 2009

		Military history reviewers' award
		By order of the Military history WikiProject coordinators, for your good work helping with the WikiProject's Peer and A-Class reviews during the period July-December 2009, I hereby award you this Military history WikiProject Reviewers' award. TomStar81 (Talk) 01:59, 1 September 2010 (UTC) Keep track of upcoming reviews. Just copy and paste {{WPMILHIST Review alerts}} to your user space

To be honest I am not sure why the review template is not displaying correctly here, the only thing I found off such as it were was the use of the word "template" in the display since its not actually needed, just the WPMILHIST alert part is required to display the table. Tweaking the text did not help any, neither did the use of the de-bunching templates;vmaybe you could ask Kirill Lokshin to take a look at it, he would probably know how to fix it. And you are right about the award - the idea here is to generate more participation in the review department since less than 10 of the milhist editors routinely account for more than 90% of the milhist review participants. More variety would be warmly welcomed. TomStar81 (Talk) 21:55, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

It works now. It just needed the word "template" knocking out of the instruction :)  Roger Davies ^talk 04:11, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, maybe it is now better in some way, i am not sure. But it does not seem to behave properly in the sense that it will not stay down, below other review-list-type boxes that I display on this Talk page. If it is not first in the order I try to impose, as now, it is jumping up above others and sitting at the center. If it is first in the order it does seem to sit to the right, though there is some other problem making the actual Talk stuff appear way low, after all of the boxes. I don't know, maybe there are programming complications due to my complex Talk page. --doncram (talk) 04:18, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Legg House

I expect that you've done the best thing, although I hope that we don't see another "Shelby House" issue happen; I simply observed that there were no other places on the Register named "Legg House", and there was no page at Legg House. I don't think it a good idea to disambiguate by geography when there's no disambiguation page, but now that the page is created, I have no complaints. You're wrong on one minor issue: I have no immediate plans to write about it, for Indiana's SHAARD system is far less helpful than Pennsylvania's CRGIS or a double volume work on Ohio listings that I found in print. I've borrowed a Monroe-and-surrounding-counties history book from the local library, although I've not yet looked through it a lot; hopefully I can get some material written, but I don't know how much. Right now, however, I'm on a different subject; check Francis Farm Petroglyphs Site, which will soon be blue. Nyttend (talk) 13:44, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Disambig question

Seeing as how you deal with disambig policies on more regular basis, I wonder if you might look at an article I ran across recently: Wheatland (Lancaster), an NHL and former home of President James Buchanan. Obviously the disambiguation is non-standard and should be moved to "Wheatland (Lancaster, Pennsylvania)", but I'm curious as whether WP:PRIMARYUSAGE might come in to play here instead, seeing as how it was a presidential home similiar to Mount Vernon or Monticello. Thoughts? ​​​​​​​​Niagara ​​^{Don't give up the ship} 23:45, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Sounds like it would be more important than the combination of all other historic houses of that name, but it would not be more likely sought than the combination of all other "Wheatland" usages, because of the several city/town ones. That's pretty much how primaryusage works. So i'd recommend your first suggested option. Hope this helps. --doncram (talk) 03:05, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for clarifying, that is understandable. Howeber, the more I think about, the more I like "Wheatland (James Buchanan House)", similar to Oak Hill (James Monroe House), for much of the same reasons discussed in the RM (the alternate name of the house, as well as not acually being in a city). Thanks again. ​​​​​​​​Niagara ​​^{Don't give up the ship} 04:34, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

that sounds fine. --doncram (talk) 04:05, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Source link dead

I'm looking for a source from the NPS that states how many NHLs are in Albany, New York. The current source's (#178) link has died. Can you help? I'm brining this to FAC now. upstateNYer 22:25, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

This is about the nationwide NHL list. Hopefully my edits here in the Albany, New York article, 2 of the 3 edits captured in that diff, helped. The 2007 PDF document is no longer available, should be updated in all the NHL articles that cite the LIST07.pdf document. --doncram (talk) 13:07, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Warren lodge and NY grand lodge source

I will be going in to Grand Lodge next week (next Tuesday)... and will check the source for you then. Blueboar (talk) 12:51, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

your pal

Hey, it's me, your pal lvklock. Thought I'd check in and see if you need me to disingenuously chime in on anything. You know I'm not bright enough to form my own opinions, so I can only go around echoing yours. Of course, I proved that by actually missing the fact that a comment on some silly controversy was actually over a year old....imagine it not occuring to someone that the same argument might have been going on for that long! Anyway, you just let me know where you want me to comment next and what you want me to say, because you can't speak well enough for yourself, and I can't think up anything to say on my own. Lvklock (talk) 17:39, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

LOL :) --doncram (talk) 17:43, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Edit warring at Prospect Hill (New Haven)

You have been blocked from editing for a period of 48 hours for your disruption caused by your engagement in an edit war at Prospect Hill (New Haven). During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection. If you would like to be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding below this notice the text {{unblock|Your reason here}}, but you should read the guide to appealing blocks first.

The complete report of this case is at WP:AN3#User:Polaron reported by doncram (talk) (Result: Both 48h). EdJohnston (talk) 05:21, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

"unblock|Time limit expired"

More than 48 hours has gone by, since the message of "22:22, 7 September 2010 EdJohnston (talk | contribs) blocked Doncram (talk | contribs) (account creation blocked) with an expiry time of 48 hours". Would someone please unblock this? --doncram (talk) 15:31, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Are you sure you can't edit? The block was supposed to expire automatically. I tried to unblock you manually, and got the message that you are not currently blocked. --Orlady (talk) 15:39, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

When i posted that, i could not edit: i was cutting and pasting from the message i got when i tried to edit. Now i can. Thanks for whatever you did to fix it. --doncram (talk) 15:44, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

That was me -- I lifted the autoblock, and then got distracted by a barking dog. --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 15:51, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Casa Paoli

Please note the nomination at Wikipedia:Copyright problems/2010 September 8 for Casa Paoli. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 02:36, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

Help. I am currently blocked for 24 hours or so from now, and cannot respond there. The issue is that the article text follows the NRHP nomination document too closely and it should be re-written. I am sure i did not myself copy that text verbatim, but an article co-author may well have assumed the text was in the public domain. It is not. The nom author Juan Santos should not be being bothered about this. The author did cooperate very nicely in releasing the photos that are included in the article. It is, frankly, a bit embarassing for the person to be being contacted again now. I personally do not want for anyone to request release of the document text, and since he was asked to release the photos (which he did in correspondence to me, and I posted them to commons under suitable license for him), he may misunderstand that is what would be asked now. There's no need to bother the guy! I would be glad to do a rewrite to avoid plagiarism / appearance thereof. Could someone possibly please do me a favor and mention this offer at the copyright problems discussion? --doncram (talk) 03:50, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

I went to do this and actually hit an ec with Orlady doing the same thing. Anyway, it was passed along as you requested. Lvklock (talk) 04:40, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

Doncram, Please note that you apparently failed to realize I had been involved in discussions with the copyvio administrator when you reverted to a much older version that didn't include all the facts. Regards, Mercy11 (talk) 01:07, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Update: Please see this note of approval from the copyvio admin for the version I just installed replacing your recent edit. Regards, Mercy11 (talk) 01:15, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

WikiProject Connecticut Autumn 2010 Photo Contest

As a member of WikiProject Connecticut, you are invited to participate in the WikiProject Connecticut AUTUMN 2010 Photo Contest! Rules: You must take the picture yourself; adding public domain pictures (i.e. postcards from pre-1923 that are on a website) will NOT count. The picture cannot already exist on Wikipedia, in Commons, etc. The picture must be of something notable for a CT rated article and be of decent quality. You may not add more than 5 pictures to any one article during the contest. All photos must be uploaded and added to their articles. If it wasn't added to the article and titled, it doesn't count. All submissions must be made after 12:00 UTC (8:00 AM EST) on September 15th, 2010 and no later than 23:59 UTC (7:59 PM EST) on October 31st, 2010. Everyone who adds 15 pictures will earn a barnstar, and the editor who adds the most pictures will earn a special unique barnstar! To enter the contest, click here. Thanks for your attention and good luck! –Grondemar 04:14, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

YMCA list

Sounds and looks good to me. Is there anything further that you think needs to be done before removing the list of buildings from the dab page, or did you just want to wait a few days to make sure no drama erupted from the new list? Propaniac (talk) 13:20, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

I do not object to the list article, but a person visiting that article might reasonably ask "What is a YMCA building"? Without a lead section to provide a context, I think it is likely to be challenged. --Orlady (talk) 15:08, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Voting

Not sure if you're aware of it, but you may wish to go and vote here

ALR (talk) 15:15, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Edit warring noticeboard

Another report filed against you by an editor here. --Spike Wilbury (talk) 18:05, 14 September 2010 (UTC)