User talk:Erminwin

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Posted automatically via sandbox guided tour. Erminwin (talk) 22:20, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

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Tai peoples,...

I am informing you that the fanatic tai-only user has striked again. He is currently reverting your edits and claim that you are aswell, like many other non-related users, a sockpuppet... 213.162.72.195 (talk) 21:54, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

• GAB is closing that the sockpuppet investigation proposed by that Tai-only user (most likely User:Bokworm8899). Still, I decide not to revert their edits for fear of starting an edit war.Erminwin (talk) 06:54, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

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remember Wiki's tenant: Verifiability, Not Truth

Sometimes the Reliable Sources may seem questionable, but we can't just drive-by change article text without a Reliable Source to back it up. HammerFilmFan (talk) 04:32, 16 February 2020 (UTC)

• @HammerFilmFan: The "Reliable Source" John Chambers's "The Devil's Horsemen" did not identify the "Saxins" (p. 48, 49) / "Saxin tribes" (p. 31) with "East Saxons".Erminwin (talk) 09:52, 16 February 2020 (UTC)

better read the footnotes more closely - the revamping of this article was done in collaboration with 2 professors who authored books on the Mongols, besides my own colleagues at Duke

Do you have an RS that has a better definition of "Saxins"? This article has been vandalized by drive-by IP's from Russia, etc., since we re-vamped it a few years ago - I am not sure without digging through the history of where the definition was obtained-several other history buffs have tried to fix the article when this happened, and it's possible a reference was lost-Chambers does indeed not directly define who they were-this may have come from email correspondence from Morgan, or Trumble. I am all in favor of improving this article. I'm going to search through my various sources in the meantime. Thanks. HammerFilmFan (talk) 20:36, 18 February 2020 (UTC)

• @HammerFilmFan: Hudud al-'Alam 'The Regions of the World' - A Persian Geography 372 A.H. (982 AD), by V. V. Minorsky & C. E. Bosworth would be such a RS. Minorsky wrote that: "The first element of Sārigh-sh.n is evidently Turkish [sic] sarigh "yellow" [...] I am strongly inclined that the name *Sarigh-shin is the original form of the enigmatic [...] Saqsin, as the geographer of Mongol times called a town situated by a mighty river and usually quoted along with the Volga Bulghar, cf. Bartold Saķsīn in EI." (italic in original)

Sock IP of Bookworm8899 seems to be back

Hello, the long term vandal and Tai only pusher Bookworm8899 seems to be back adding unsourced maps made by his sock on wikimedia. He is currently using several IPs. As example please see Vietnamese language. Greetings.38.121.43.37 (talk) 19:08, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

• Well, you already cleaned up his vandalism. So... good job! Erminwin (talk) 02:03, 2 April 2020 (UTC)

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Requesting expansion and update support

Hi,

Season's greetings

I am looking for proactive expansion and update support/input help any of the following (So far neglected but important topic) articles. If you can't spare time but if you know any good references you can note those on talk pages.

• Islamic advice literature

Your user ID was selected randomly (for sake of neutrality) from related other articles changes list related to Turkestan

Thanks and warm regards

Bookku (talk) 11:53, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Non-correlation between statement and sources

Hi, the recent sock-edits, including the whole sequence in the leading part #Origins, about the proto-turkic homeland simply isn’t backed up by the sources. There is not one sentence in the given references. You have to check the sources before you allow abusive sockcontent. However, considering the context of that „Transeurasian theory“, an absolute minority view among linguists, these studies belong to the article Altaic languages. Yours thankfully —Lithuist (talk) 08:46, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

@Lithuist:. This has nothing to do with allowing abusive sock content. There are several other editors involved with restoring this material. Also, please discuss this on the article talk page if you wish. Additionally, Hunan201p does not have a lot of credibility pertaining to their editing history. That editor had no problem misrepresenting their edits to support dominating articles with their POV, violating wp:npov while also edit warring, resulting in WP:OWN behavior. Take a look at the second half of their user talk page.

As an aside, I have to wonder, with only one or two edits attributed to your user name, I am wondering if you are a sock. Do you have a blocked account and are you circumventing that blocked account? Do you have other Wikipedia accounts? ---Steve Quinn (talk) 14:53, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

""@Steve Quinn: they are CU blocked, see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Tirgil34. Doug Weller talk 14:45, 4 June 2020 (UTC)

@Doug Weller::Tirgil34 did psycholgoically project their sock-puppeteering too much.Erminwin (talk) 18:05, 6 June 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Long-term abuse/Tirgil34 is desperate. Now he uses IP-hopping for block evasion; e.g. [1][2][3]. --Wario-Man (talk) 06:49, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

Wario-Man: Can't tell if the vandal who has a pro-Turkic bias & keep vandalizing articles on Tuoba, Tuoba language, Rouran Khaganate, Tatar confederation, and Tatars were Wikipedia:Long-term abuse/Tirgil34 or no. Though that vandal embarrassingly exposed their ignorance, when vandalizing the Tuoba's article by citing Mahmud al-Kashgari to assert that the "Tuoba were a division of Turkic peoples" even though the Tuoba article contains an an entire section devoting to the semantic shift from the Tuoba & Northern Wei to Song China in Kashgari's time.

That IP-hopper is not Tirgil34 but they could be a WP:MEATPUPPET (because Tirgil34 promotes his stuff on web and it seems some people follow his agenda) or just another pro-Turkic and Pan-Turkist user. Tirgil34's agenda/quest is summarized on his LTA page. Tirgil34 in a nutshell: Everything was/is Turkic. --Wario-Man (talk) 01:59, 10 June 2020 (UTC)

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Dubious and questionable content

Hi. Could you review this article? The claims in sections like Origins and Ethnogenesis sound WP:FRINGE. --Wario-Man (talk) 02:21, 29 July 2020 (UTC)

@Wario-Man: Thanks for bring that to my attention. I deleted the whole Ethnogenesis section. The writer stopped short of classifying many vanished historical Iranian-speaking groups as Turkic. Yet such assertions as "the ethnic continuity and cultural uniformity of the Turkmen of the present time with the ancient population of the western part of Central Asia of the Hunnic (4th-5th centuries) and even the Parthian-Kanguy (more than 2 thousand years ago) periods becomes obvious." are Pan-Turkic insinuations.Erminwin (talk) 13:01, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for solving the issues. Is Vasily Bartold's claim "特拘梦 was a transliteration of the country name Türkmen" verified? If the answer is yes, then are there alternative claims by other scholars? Please keep watching that article because that user seems like adding fringe, pov, and unsourced stuff; e.g. [4] and on other articles [5][6][7]. --Wario-Man (talk) 03:16, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

@Wario-Man: To be honest, I do not possess any copy of Bartold's Four Studies, therefore I cannot verify that claim as of now. I assumed good faith on that user's part that they'd faithfully paraphrased Bartold's opinion on the link between 特拘梦 (pinyin: Tejumeng; writer's transliteration (presumable Bartold's): T’ö-kü-Möng) and Türkmen. Erminwin (talk) 13:01, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

Giving grettings

Hello Ermiwin, i am sorry that i sounded scournful on your sir-kivchak post on rereading the phonetics of the turkish runes (new to wikipedia, just learning the ropes and reread my posts), https://bitig.kz/?lang=e&mod=1&tid=1&oid=24&m=1, ive been looking on some alternative reading aswell on that site now, its a misstake to use on coam for diffrent works, but rereading that Inscription i am even more confused how that text was translated withouth knowledge of Chinese or the other eastern languages?.You seem to be keen on this, il save my questions for that you reply that we should keep in touch on this subject, and Ergins book you have, is its a new publication?. I kind of lost faith in old turkic as a science since it was show (by me reading) misstankely that some modern Persian christian prayers were bundeld together with Turfan manuscripts somehow, and there was a "translation" but the text was our father in heaven from the bible. I got 3 readings on that page wich are titles, and a list of words wich i would like to discuss, if you want that aswell. We should try new readings of middle chineses aswell since it seems you have been at study. Hope you are pleased to reply that you wish the same communications between us.Bennanak88 (talk) 21:33, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

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Xionites/Chionites and Kidarites

Hi Erminwin, you seem to be very knowledgeable about the Hephthalites, I was wondering if you know of any good/important soures about their fellow Hunnic cousins - the Xionites/Chionites and Kidarites? --HistoryofIran (talk) 23:26, 16 November 2020 (UTC)

• @HistoryofIran: In Prof Yu Taishan's collection, available here Kidara (Jiduoluo) were mentioned in passing. I'll look for more secondary sources. Erminwin (talk) 02:54, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks! Yeah that would be awesome. Even better if it included information about their culture, language and possible background. --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:19, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Khalji dynasty

Hi i have seen that you have been a great contributor to the Turkic pages and I would like to request your input to the Khalji dynasty page. If you look at the edit history i am sure you would understand the issue. If you look at the revert below, you could easily identify the information does not correspond to what is mentioned in the references. I wanted to see if you could help correct the article in accordance to the references or provide any advice. [[8]] Thankyou Regards Kami2018 (talk) 04:38, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

I would appreciate your reply in relation to this. Kami2018 (talk) 04:57, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

• @Kami2018: I've been dealing with other obligations. Now to the the subject at hand, I don't think you and HistoryofIran disagreed substantively: both you & they agreed that the Afghan Khalji dynasty were of Turkic origin. More like they found the tone of your edit to be too subjective & therefore thought of your edit as POV-pushing. I'd recommend that you ask, in the Khalji dynasty article's talk page, about how to incorporate your sources (Jackson, 2003; Srivastava, 1966; Eraly, 2015; Chaurasia) into the article. Regards!Erminwin (talk) 02:50, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

This has already been addressed [9], it was my bad. --HistoryofIran (talk) 16:03, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Ularg/Oglar

Hi Erminwin. Grenet, Ur-Rahman, and Sims-Williams (2006:125-127) actually refer to another seal found in Kashmir (not Samarkand), which has the reading "ολαρ(γ)ο" (seal AA2.3) (in Grenet, Frantz. "A Hunnish Kushanshah". {{cite journal}}: Cite journal requires |journal= (help)). The seal from Samarkand was published in 2011 by Sim-Williams (seal AA2) with the reading "ογλαρ(γ)ο", which he transliterates as "lord Uglarg/Ularg" (see in Bakker, Hans T. The Alkhan: A Hunnic People in South Asia. Barkhuis. p. 13, note 17. ISBN 978-94-93194-00-7.). This must be the reason for de la Vaissière's take. I'll try to tweak the note accordingly. Thanks for the research! पाटलिपुत्र Pat (talk) 06:26, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

• @पाटलिपुत्र:Thanks for the information! Erminwin (talk) 14:09, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

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Season's Greetings

	Season's Greetings
	Wishing you a Happy Holiday Season, and a beautiful and productive New Year! पाटलिपुत्र Pat (talk) 16:22, 21 December 2020 (UTC)

• My many thanks, पाटलिपुत्र Pat! The same to you! Erminwin (talk) 05:03, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

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Misleading section "anthropology" in the article about Kipchak.

Hello, I wanted to delete/hide a misleading section in the article Kipchaks. The references do not appear to support the claimed English sentences. At first, the Chinese quotation does not contain the words blonde or blue eyed people. This seems to be a misleading inclusion by long-term abuser Tirgil34, who is known for the claims of blonde and blue eyed Turks. Secondly, the references about "Caucasian" and "Mongoloid" phenotypes is in fact a historical reference about various people of the region and I could not find the words Caucasian or Mongoloid as claimed in the section. Thus the whole section is WP:OR and fails WP:V. Could you please take a look at this section? You can check the references yourself and will see what I mean. Thank you in advance.213.162.73.198 (talk) 12:23, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

I have now included a working reference and included some quotations to fix the first part. Regarding the second part of a reference from an Ukrainian anthropologist, I have not full access and can not verify if the content is correct. Maybe you have access?213.162.73.33 (talk) 14:52, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

"At first, the Chinese quotation does not contain the words blonde or blue eyed people" Can you read Chinese? I can. I'm not Tirgil34 & I doubt that Tirgil34 can read Chinese. "青目赤髪" means "blue/green-eyed [and] red-haired". I even linked to the page in Xu Qianxue's later edition of Sima Guang's Zizhi Tongjian. Vol. 141 f.21a. Also, this is a direct quote from Lee & Kuang's paper 2017 "Concerning the physiognomy of the Qipchaq tribe, the Zizhi tongjian houbian [Later compilation to the comprehensive mirror to aid in government], a seventeenth-century continuation of Sima Guang’s Zizhi tongjian by Xu Qianxue, states that they had ‘blue eyes and red hair (青目赤髪)’." (p. 207) Also, Lee & Kuang quoted Yuanshi when mentioning the Kipchak clan's Ölberli, not Xu Qianxue's later edition of Sima Guang's Zizhi Tongjian Erminwin (talk) 20:31, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

Can you improve/rewrite this article?

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Discussion at Talk:Khwarazmian dynasty § Splitting proposal

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Tatars

Some IP user removed your additions, could you check maybe? Beshogur (talk) 18:52, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

@Beshogur: Those ultra-nationalists again. Thanks for informing me!

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Flag of South Vietnam

Could you also add that information to the "Flag of South Vietnam" article proper (as Great Brightstar had already made some improvements). Also, who designed the original flag of the Autonomous Republic of Cochinchina and what did it symbolise (the same three regions as the later flag?) and what was the meaning of the white stripes? I have been able to find very little information about the Cochinchinese flag (on which the South Vietnamese flag was most likely based) and Musée Annam in all his arrogance never provides sources and was the originator of the "Thành Thái hoax" on Wikipedia (as well as a LARGE number of other fantasy flags), in fact, Musée Annam found the correct Cochinchinese flag but this one was deleted almost a dozen times as "a fantasy" off of Wikimedia Commons because at no point did he ever provide sources other than "I said so" and just slung insults at anyone that ever dared question his reasoning (hence he is globally banned as this behaviour is a red thread through his contributions), but he did manage to correctly identify more Vietnamese flags than anyone else here (though this could be because he likely just throws everything he can find at the wall and then sees what sticks).

I am actually planning on diving deeper into the history of 1940's French Cochinchina but I have been unable to find the exact origin or meaning of the French Cochinchinese flag (although I did find a possible designer called "Ton That" something). --Donald Trung (talk) 19:50, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

• @Donald Trung:. Nguyễn Ngọc Huy's 1988 article only confirmed the existence of yellow-blue-white version of its the flag Autonomous Republic of Cochinchina yet, unfortunately for us, did not mention its author nor what the three blue stripes stood for. According to these two articles, one by Nam Quốc and another by Nguyễn Anh, the three blue stripes supposedly stand for the three great rivers in Southern Vietnam: Đồng Nai river, Tiền River, Hậu River. NA also claims that originally, from 01 Jun 1946 to 30 Oct 1946, the two white stripes did not exist, but was only added on Oct 31 to make the flag "less dark" đỡ tối; NA included many photographs as evidence yet none of the colored ones showed the yellow flag with only three blue stripes & zero white stripes: the one subtitled Ra mắt Chính phủ Nam Kỳ tự trị năm 1946 phía sau là cờ Pháp và cờ vàng ba sọc xanh (Presenting the government of the Autonomous South in 1946, after the French flag comes the yellow flag with three blue stripes) was not a colored photo so no way I can tell if two light stripes (alternating with the three dark ones) were yellow or white. NQ cited historian Chính Đạo (Vũ Ngự Chiêu) who claimed that ARVN general Nguyễn Khánh claimed that the yellow flag with three red stripes had been influenced by the yellow flag with three blue stripes. I'm skeptical of NQ's & NA's claims though because their academic credentials are unknown, while NNH was a professor of Political Studies and Constitutional Law at Học viện Quốc gia Hành chánh, so NNH is more reliable. Erminwin (talk) 22:14, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for all the information, for whatever weird reason I haven't been able to get any notifications from Wikipedia now for perhaps half a year when someone pings me (though I do still get them for Wikimedia Commons at times, strangely enough). Thanks for all the research and your additions. --Donald Trung (talk) 23:21, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

Interestingly enough, the flag with white stripes has been deleted many times at Wikimedia websites as "fake" and some sources claim that the flag was a misinterpretation that never existed. Despite this however, lots of contemporary evidence exists. Both the flag with the white stripes and without it have been documented and many different reports exists on when which version was used. Of course, the flag with white stripes was only deleted as "fictional" because at no point did the uploader(s) ever bother adding primary sources that confirm its existence. --Donald Trung (talk) 23:27, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

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Fantasy flags of Đại Việt

• I am planning on covering the many fantasy flags of Đại Việt but the undeletion request is still open (after 3 months), I found that some of them are hung in the Museum of Military History in Hanoi but I don't know if they are the origin of these flags or not. Usually the interpretation is "a banner with the surname of the Emperor" which might have been a Vietnamese family flag design but I am heavily inclined to think that these are later made fantasies. Do you have any additional information about them that I might have missed? --Donald Trung (talk) 07:17, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

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Recent edits on Xiongnu

Hey Erminwin, could you please check the recent edits in the article Xiongnu, see:https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Xiongnu&type=revision&diff=1061856088&oldid=1061485801. There seems to be obvious problems regarding WP:TOPIC, WP:OR, and WP:POV. I mean, making large additions about "Caucasoid" and "Europid" peoples, linking Tarim mummies with Indo-Europeans and making bold claims is rather WP:Fringe. There may be some useful references, but the section needs clearly WP:Cleanup. Anyway, happy Christmas and a good new year! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:4BC9:924:6152:DDE3:6173:B15F:F959 (talk) 17:38, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

Would you please comment on the recent edits of Hunan201p, see the talk page, he is misrepresenting genetic data to serve an white supremacist agendas, as in the past. He even got blocked for 3m months and is also suggested to be either WCF himself or Tirgil34. Maybe a false flag operation.2001:4BC9:920:2636:8C6A:F1C7:7A24:D0FB (talk) 14:32, 27 December 2021 (UTC)